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  1. #1101
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    Turner was pulled from the game because he tested positive for Covid. Unbelievable.
    And then selfish idiot goes on the field to celebrate.

    I wonder if other Dodgers will test positive and what would have happened to G7 had the Rays come back.
    Baseball is life;
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  2. #1102
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Tripper View Post
    And then selfish idiot goes on the field to celebrate.

    I wonder if other Dodgers will test positive and what would have happened to G7 had the Rays come back.
    I thought he only came back for the team photo. I also doubt the players care if they catch it feeling it is worth it to win it all. As for game 7 that is an interesting question.
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  3. #1103
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Donnybaseball72 View Post
    I thought he only came back for the team photo. I also doubt the players care if they catch it feeling it is worth it to win it all. As for game 7 that is an interesting question.
    Yeah. What if a significant number of Dodgers had been infected. Would game 7 have been postponed? Probably more likely they would have declared the Rays and Dodgers co champions and be done with it. Cash might have done Manfred a favor pulling Snell when he did.

  4. #1104
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    Yeah. What if a significant number of Dodgers had been infected. Would game 7 have been postponed? Probably more likely they would have declared the Rays and Dodgers co champions and be done with it. Cash might have done Manfred a favor pulling Snell when he did.
    Highly doubtful. Just delay game 7 until the next round of PCR tests are implemented.
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  5. #1105
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Donnybaseball72 View Post
    Highly doubtful. Just delay game 7 until the next round of PCR tests are implemented.
    And how many days would that take? You expect the fans who bought tickets to just wait around? And my original point was if a significant amount of players tested postive they probably end the series. If only Turner was infected then game 7 would be played.

  6. #1106
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    That whole thing was just too bizarre. Turner being on the field potentially spreading the virus to family members, media, whomever, and then the picture of him kissing his wife or girlfriend was the perfect snapshot of 2020.

    And the test that came back inconclusive, but he still gets to play pending further testing? Just pure, unmitigated garbage.

    I don’t care if there are a lot of false positives, or inconclusive tests come back negative more than they do positive. If you’re going to play baseball, then do it right.
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  7. #1107

    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Turner should start the 2021 season with a lengthy suspension.

  8. #1108
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    And how many days would that take? You expect the fans who bought tickets to just wait around? And my original point was if a significant amount of players tested postive they probably end the series. If only Turner was infected then game 7 would be played.
    Fans lolololol

    But yeah either delay G7 or Dodgers play short if it’s just Turner.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  9. #1109
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Tripper View Post
    Fans lolololol

    But yeah either delay G7 or Dodgers play short if it’s just Turner.
    I actually know 2 people who flew out from NYC for games 6 & 7.

  10. #1110
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    I actually know 2 people who flew out from NYC for games 6 & 7.
    I think the idea that MLB would have given any consideration to people who had tickets to WC is quaint.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  11. #1111
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post
    Disagree. The overreaction is the over-reliance on analytics. Cash looked good compared to Boone, but in the end, he was the same guy after all, because we all know Boone would’ve done the same thing.
    It's fair. In general I think analytics and relying on a super flexible pitching staff is what got them there, so it doesn't surprise me that they leaned on it again.

    It eventually burned them because Cash was too rigid with it here, but again they have a large chance of losing that game regardless if they are going to throw 1 run on the board and strike out every other at bat.

  12. #1112
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jace View Post
    It's fair. In general I think analytics and relying on a super flexible pitching staff is what got them there, so it doesn't surprise me that they leaned on it again.

    It eventually burned them because Cash was too rigid with it here, but again they have a large chance of losing that game regardless if they are going to throw 1 run on the board and strike out every other at bat.
    True, but I want Snell through that top of the order again considering how badly he castrated them the first two times through the order. Hyperbole aside, the Dodgers were up against the ropes with Snell on the hill, and they exploded once he was out of the game.

    The problem with analytics is there's no way to quantify that, other than to qualify it with an in-game tactician who appreciates managing.
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  13. #1113
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jace View Post
    The decision seems dumb, but I think this is an overreaction.

    - They got to Game 6 of the WS by being unorthodox and playing with analytics-driven modular-pitching-staff approach over traditional decision-making. It just worked a surprisingly large percentage of the time to this point
    - I think everybody is focusing their irritation at MLB-wide trigger happy pitching changes on Cash right now. This isn't just about this decision, it feels like an I-told-you-so referendum on all things modern bullpen
    - You scored 1 run, Kiermaier. How many games do you expect to win like that? If Chapman gets either borderline 3rd strike in Game 5 vs the Yankees, that might have been another 1 run loss for them (depending on if the Yankees won the solo HR fest)

    People were basically calling Kevin Cash a huge genius for his innovative approach not that long ago, right? This was a clear mistake, but I doubt Snell goes 9 shutout innings. TB likely needs to score more anyway.

    To me the bigger factor was the TB offense. Led the league (in a bad way) in strikeouts this year, and 16 in 9 innings in the deciding WS game is almost as bad as the Yankees' 18 in whatever game that was.
    I strongly disagree with this. Cash made the wrong move at that moment and everyone watching knew it in real time except the manager. A “genius” that does the same move every 3rd time through the lineup no matter what is no genius but a mindless drone that does whatever the binder tells him to do. A real manager can read the room and understand when a guy is dealing with only 70 pitches thrown you LEAVE HIM IN!! The nerds are ruining the sport by trying to remove the human element.

  14. #1114

    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JRRandall View Post
    I strongly disagree with this. Cash made the wrong move at that moment and everyone watching knew it in real time except the manager. A “genius” that does the same move every 3rd time through the lineup no matter what is no genius but a mindless drone that does whatever the binder tells him to do. A real manager can read the room and understand when a guy is dealing with only 70 pitches thrown you LEAVE HIM IN!! The nerds are ruining the sport by trying to remove the human element.
    Unfortunately, they're not just trying; they're succeeding. Those of you here who remember game 7 of the 1962 world series for example will have to treasure memories of such a game like that because the people calling the shots in the game today won't sit still long enough to allow a game/series to unfold in a way that permits today's players the space to determine the outcome in such a game or series. That's a lose/lose for all concerned.

  15. #1115
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    You don't even have to go back that far back. Didn't Jack Morris pitch 10 innings to beat the Braves 1-0 in the 1991 Series?

  16. #1116
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    You don't even have to go back that far back. Didn't Jack Morris pitch 10 innings to beat the Braves 1-0 in the 1991 Series?
    Yeah I think I posted a tweet where a reporter got his thoughts on Snell getting yanked like that.

    He did say that if TK (Tom Kelly) tried to take him out there likely would've been a fight.
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  17. #1117
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by theM&Mboys View Post
    Unfortunately, they're not just trying; they're succeeding. Those of you here who remember game 7 of the 1962 world series for example will have to treasure memories of such a game like that because the people calling the shots in the game today won't sit still long enough to allow a game/series to unfold in a way that permits today's players the space to determine the outcome in such a game or series. That's a lose/lose for all concerned.
    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    You don't even have to go back that far back. Didn't Jack Morris pitch 10 innings to beat the Braves 1-0 in the 1991 Series?
    Great points. This could be the best example how the game is changing in a negative way. Imagine Snell going 9 innings and the Rays winning 1-0. It is entirely possible that it could have gone down as one of the greatest performances in WS history - especially if the Rays won game 7. Of course, anything could have happened - Snell may have imploded for all we know. But we will never know - and if Cash had left him in and still lost, I doubt he would be second guessed the way he is now.
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  18. #1118
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by CalYankeeFan View Post
    Great points. This could be the best example how the game is changing in a negative way. Imagine Snell going 9 innings and the Rays winning 1-0. It is entirely possible that it could have gone down as one of the greatest performances in WS history - especially if the Rays won game 7. Of course, anything could have happened - Snell may have imploded for all we know. But we will never know - and if Cash had left him in and still lost, I doubt he would be second guessed the way he is now.
    It’s an indictment of where the game is now and is headed. Frankly, it’s just not as fun as it once was, says the old man yelling at the clouds.
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  19. #1119
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by CalYankeeFan View Post
    Great points. This could be the best example how the game is changing in a negative way. Imagine Snell going 9 innings and the Rays winning 1-0. It is entirely possible that it could have gone down as one of the greatest performances in WS history - especially if the Rays won game 7. Of course, anything could have happened - Snell may have imploded for all we know. But we will never know - and if Cash had left him in and still lost, I doubt he would be second guessed the way he is now.
    He would have had to been at only 60 pitches through 6 for that to happen. Chances are he was coming out somewhere in the 6th and Anderson or Fairbanks would have still blown the game.
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  20. #1120
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Donnybaseball72 View Post
    He would have had to been at only 60 pitches through 6 for that to happen. Chances are he was coming out somewhere in the 6th and Anderson or Fairbanks would have still blown the game.
    Yes. Chances are he might not have thrown a CG SHO, but given how overexposed the Rays’ pen became in the postseason, Snell was still their best option. By far.
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  21. #1121
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post
    Yes. Chances are he might not have thrown a CG SHO, but given how overexposed the Rays’ pen became in the postseason, Snell was still their best option. By far.
    Sounds like the same logic Grady Little used when he kept Pedro in.
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  22. #1122
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Donnybaseball72 View Post
    Sounds like the same logic Grady Little used when he kept Pedro in.
    Well, except for the fact Pedro had thrown 40 to 45 more pitches than Snell, and that Pedro actually did not have his A game going that night the way Snell clearly did, yes. Good point.
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  23. #1123
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Analytics are just numbers on a page. The problem isn't the numbers, it the slavish reliance on them to do the thinking for people. It is part of a larger movement in society to quantify everything and deprofessionalize certain jobs. The issue with this is that many things are not quantifiable or are not quantifiable in a way that is meaningfully helpful in every case. As ojo pointed out, aggregate data is not revelatory in a moment where you are clearly witnessing an outlier case unfolding. This is where critical thinking and judgement have to override a predetermined plans and aggregate data.

  24. #1124
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post
    Well, except for the fact Pedro had thrown 40 to 45 more pitches than Snell, and that Pedro actually did not have his A game going that night the way Snell clearly did, yes. Good point.
    Pedro was over 100 pitches which was considered the limit of his effectiveness.

  25. #1125
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    Re: The 2020 MLB Postseason Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    Pedro was over 100 pitches which was considered the limit of his effectiveness.
    I remember him being visibly gassed and I was hoping that Grady would leave him in.

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