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  1. #426
    New Murderer's Row False1's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post
    Full disclosure: If the Mets and Dodgers were in the AL, then Piazza should've been a DH.

    Forget about hoping the Yankee catcher can be replacement level, or average, or rationalize-away why the passed balls don't suck so bad. How about having a catcher that makes your pitching better?

    Do any of us think Sanchez is that guy?
    Actually judgment of Piazza's defense has not aged well. Yes, his arm was terrible. But he was very good at framing and blocking, more than compensating for his issues in the running game. The measurement systems just weren't there to acknowledge his overall defense.

    Similarly for Sanchez, if passed balls were his only issue and he was still elite and managing the running game and strong at framing, that's more than good enough if he was still hitting like peak Gary. Problem is, his former strengths have deteriorated significantly defensively and offensively.

  2. #427
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Bauer View Post
    Perhaps you're right in your "that time isn't now" conclusion. However, I'd make him the BUC to Higashioka because that does take the spotlight off him. He can have the occasional game behind the plate and do the occasional DH stint--and work on his problems more quietly than as the front-line catcher.
    I think if they don't non-tender him, they'll either trade him or start him. But I doubt they'll pay him $6M to only get 300 ABs.
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  3. #428
    New Murderer's Row False1's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    I think if they don't non-tender him, they'll either trade him or start him. But I doubt they'll pay him $6M to only get 300 ABs.
    In an ideal scenario, they wouldn't really be paying him $6MM (my guess is closer to $5MM FWIW) to only get 300 ABs. They'd be paying that money in the hopes that next year he can find himself at the plate and possibly even behind it to a degree, and either earn more than 300 AB as an asset to the team or at least regain some trade value. The alternative is you let him walk for nothing and run the risk he rediscovers himself elsewhere at a rock bottom price. I don't think they want to take that risk.

    All that said, I am concerned that if they don't non-tender he'll be primed as the starter without any real competition - which would be a mistake IMHO.

  4. #429
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    In an ideal scenario, they wouldn't really be paying him $6MM (my guess is closer to $5MM FWIW) to only get 300 ABs. They'd be paying that money in the hopes that next year he can find himself at the plate and possibly even behind it to a degree, and either earn more than 300 AB as an asset to the team or at least regain some trade value. The alternative is you let him walk for nothing and run the risk he rediscovers himself elsewhere at a rock bottom price. I don't think they want to take that risk.

    All that said, I am concerned that if they don't non-tender he'll be primed as the starter without any real competition - which would be a mistake IMHO.
    I was responding to the OP's opinion that he'd make Sanchez a BUC who "can have the occasional game behind the plate and do the occasional DH stint" (which to me equates to a pretty limited role) in order to "work out his problems".

    I've always believed that it's extremely tough for an everyday player to actually improve in a limited role. It's the opposite of "routine".

    That said, I think we both agree that the Yanks won't non-tender Sanchez and that he'll have an equal opportunity of winning the starting role @ C along with Higashioka, especially since his contract will probably be between $5M-$6M.

    I really think the whole extending-of-the-leg experiment in 2020 totally messed Gary up and that he needs to be able to squat and be on his toes behind the plate. I couldn't care less about his framing ability. He cuts down base-stealers regularly with a cannon arm, and he needs the agility of being on his toes to block balls in the dirt, instead of not being balanced by having his leg extended.

    Offensively, I think he needs to cut down on his leg kick (to get his swing through the zone faster) and concentrate on making hard contact rather than pulling for power. Do you remember how Paul O'Neill used to tap his front toe as a timing mechanism, rather than have a leg-kick? Maybe Paul could help Sanchez.

    Then I think to myself, "since when did you become an expert on catching and hitting?" lol
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  5. #430
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Is he asking for $6 million in arbitration or is that just speculation? He should not get a cent more than what he made last year.
    http://vimel.ru/e6748

  6. #431
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Donnybaseball72 View Post
    Is he asking for $6 million in arbitration or is that just speculation? He should not get a cent more than what he made last year.
    From what I understand players that goes through arbitration always get a pay increase - they never stay the same or take a pay cut. I guess it's their reward for time served.

    Regarding Sanchez specifically, speculation shows anywhere from $5.1M - $6M but because of the shortened season hardly any speculators seems to be certain.
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  7. #432
    New Murderer's Row False1's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    From what I understand players that goes through arbitration always get a pay increase - they never stay the same or take a pay cut. I guess it's their reward for time served.

    Regarding Sanchez specifically, speculation shows anywhere from $5.1M - $6M but because of the shortened season hardly any speculators seems to be certain.
    My guess is a slight raise - so in the very low end of the range you quoted - and for the reason you quoted.

    Precedent says Sanchez will ask for a raise, and the Yankees will certainly take it to arb. If you extrapolate last year out to a full season, Sanchez had negative WAR both offensively and defensively, and would have performed 1.5 wins worse than replacement level.

  8. #433
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    My guess is a slight raise - so in the very low end of the range you quoted - and for the reason you quoted.

    Precedent says Sanchez will ask for a raise, and the Yankees will certainly take it to arb. If you extrapolate last year out to a full season, Sanchez had negative WAR both offensively and defensively, and would have performed 1.5 wins worse than replacement level.
    If it goes to arbitration, would the Yankees actually argue for a pay decrease? Salaries can be cut up to 20% in the arbitration process and, while it would get ugly, the stats for the last two of the last three years have been abysmal and his defensive numbers are not even worth looking at.
    Forgive me for taking the Contrarian view

  9. #434

    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by longtimeyankeefan View Post
    If it goes to arbitration, would the Yankees actually argue for a pay decrease? Salaries can be cut up to 20% in the arbitration process and, while it would get ugly, the stats for the last two of the last three years have been abysmal and his defensive numbers are not even worth looking at.
    It is my understanding that arbitration decisions are either the amount asked or offered. Because their is no compromise the Yanks may be better off offering a 2021 salary similar to what Sanchez made in 2020. I kinda would like to see the Yanks unload Sanchez.
    "It is almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is playing golf." -Robert Wilson Lynd



  10. #435
    Slow in, Fast out ThePinStripes's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Yeah, it's whichever is more reasonable. No in between.
    A fool and his money can throw one heck of a party!

  11. #436
    New Murderer's Row False1's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by longtimeyankeefan View Post
    If it goes to arbitration, would the Yankees actually argue for a pay decrease? Salaries can be cut up to 20% in the arbitration process and, while it would get ugly, the stats for the last two of the last three years have been abysmal and his defensive numbers are not even worth looking at.
    They could, and arguably should... but players simply do not seem to get decreases in arb for any reason. So going for the $4MM min they could offer would likely backfire and enable Sanchez to get what he asks for (unless of course it is something entirely unreasonable). That's why I think they go with a slight raise.

  12. #437
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    Re: 2020 Gary Sanchez Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    They could, and arguably should... but players simply do not seem to get decreases in arb for any reason. So going for the $4MM min they could offer would likely backfire and enable Sanchez to get what he asks for (unless of course it is something entirely unreasonable). That's why I think they go with a slight raise.
    Excellent point
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

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