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  1. #76
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by primetime714 View Post
    I love Andujar. I think we would've missed him tremendously if not for the emergence of DJL and to a lesser extent Urshela. In 2018 Andujar was the guy that you knew would hurt a strikeout pitcher that attacked the zone. Porcello and Eovaldi dominated our lineup with that recipe in 2018. I guess I'd add the maturation of Torres as another reason we didn't miss Andujar this year. All that said I'm excited to have his style of hitting back in this lineup. I think he's guy that can come up with some big hits for us. I think you spread DJ, Andujar and Urshela across the lineup (top, middle, bottom) and it gives the Yankees a really good mix of hitting styles for pitchers to have to navigate.

    This is my ideal lineup right now:

    DJL- 2B
    Judge- RF
    Torres- SS
    Stanton- LF
    Andujar- DH/1B
    Voit- 1B/DH
    Sanchez- C
    Gardner- CF
    Urshela- 3B

    with Tauchman playing virtually everyday as the 10th man.

    Adding a Scooter Gennett type too would be the icing on the cake. And then you'd just need Wade to backup SS and Higgy to backup C.
    "Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever." - Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

  2. #77

    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by Zimmer's Helmet View Post
    I like Andujar as well and I agree he might pencil in as DH/1B but I see some issues as well:

    -I don't see Stanton as an everyday outfielder wherein lies competition for the DH role with Andujar . Sanchez needs DH time too. Stanton does not see physically able to get thru a season without significant down time. Then you have Tauchman in left and BG in center which means 2/3 of the outfield is light offensively.
    -Whether Voit or Andujar is at first, it is weak to average defensively.
    -Can Torres play every day shortstop? Does he have the range?
    -What kind of year will Sanchez have, healthwise and offensively?

    Things have to really break right here.

  3. #78
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    Exclamation Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by hhill View Post
    I like Andujar as well and I agree he might pencil in as DH/1B but I see some issues as well:

    -I don't see Stanton as an everyday outfielder wherein lies competition for the DH role with Andujar . Sanchez needs DH time too. Stanton does not see physically able to get thru a season without significant down time. Then you have Tauchman in left and BG in center which means 2/3 of the outfield is light offensively.
    -Whether Voit or Andujar is at first, it is weak to average defensively.
    -Can Torres play every day shortstop? Does he have the range?
    -What kind of year will Sanchez have, healthwise and offensively?

    Things have to really break right here.
    The injuries and a major concern, no doubt.
    But I also believe that wholesale changes in training techniques are required.

    Lesser focus on strength-training, and greater focus on agility/flexibility training.

    When I look at Stanton, I have flashbacks of Jack Clark. Same vicious lat-tearing swing.
    Increased muscle leads to a higher likelihood of pulls.
    "Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever." - Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

  4. #79
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by primetime714 View Post
    This is my ideal lineup right now:

    DJL- 2B
    Judge- RF
    Torres- SS
    Stanton- LF
    Andujar- DH/1B
    Voit- 1B/DH
    Sanchez- C
    Gardner- CF
    Urshela- 3B

    with Tauchman playing virtually everyday as the 10th man.
    Nicely done. I am salivating.
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  5. #80
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by Zimmer's Helmet View Post
    In a perfect world, you play Stanton full-time in LF and he remains healthy, with Andujar as the primary DH and backup corner infielder. I believe Voit can be a beast if heís healthy. Same with Severino, Sanchez and Judge.

    All comes down to health - always a concern for this team.
    I totally agree with this post, especially the highlighted part.

    But what is this "perfect world" you speak of, and is it a place we can visit?
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  6. #81
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by hhill View Post
    I like Andujar as well and I agree he might pencil in as DH/1B but I see some issues as well:

    -I don't see Stanton as an everyday outfielder wherein lies competition for the DH role with Andujar . Sanchez needs DH time too. Stanton does not see physically able to get thru a season without significant down time. Then you have Tauchman in left and BG in center which means 2/3 of the outfield is light offensively.
    -Whether Voit or Andujar is at first, it is weak to average defensively.
    -Can Torres play every day shortstop? Does he have the range?
    -What kind of year will Sanchez have, healthwise and offensively?

    Things have to really break right here.
    one thing i cant understand for the life of me is why anyone questions that torres can be the everyday SS , he was for most of this last season and throughout his minor league career . the yankees plan for this whole time was for torres to replace didi.

  7. #82
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by WWJD View Post
    Lol, I like Andujar a lot but the 3rd base D is suspect and to me he doesn't project as the super plate disciplined guy that seems to excel the best in the playoffs.


    Again nice problem to have but Cash is always looking to tweak the roster to make it even better if possible.

    Trading Andujar for Hader would be a mistake. Playoffs? Andujar has a total of 12 AB and 2 Ks. That earlier post was 100% correct - Andujar has a 16% K rate. He is a high contact/low K hiire for this post. I watched 2018 with Torres/Andujar back to back in the lineup and loved it. I felt they helped eachother. (IMO We sucked with this roster and would have been better with Ford and Wade) Against good pitching with HOU. I hope we don't trade Andujar unless it's for a another great SP because he can be great.

    Just find a spot for Andujar in the lineup I do believe his fielding will improve because we call 3rd the hot corner because it's tough playing up close (he needs to move back).

    I do agree his defense is "suspect" - I even say it's horrible but I feel he is improving but most project it's going to be bad next year, too.

  8. #83
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by bucky View Post
    Trading Andujar for Hader would be a mistake. Playoffs? Andujar has a total of 12 AB and 2 Ks. That earlier post was 100% correct - Andujar has a 16% K rate. He is a high contact/low K hiire for this post. I watched 2018 with Torres/Andujar back to back in the lineup and loved it. I felt they helped eachother. (IMO We sucked with this roster and would have been better with Ford and Wade) Against good pitching with HOU. I hope we don't trade Andujar unless it's for a another great SP because he can be great.

    Just find a spot for Andujar in the lineup I do believe his fielding will improve because we call 3rd the hot corner because it's tough playing up close (he needs to move back).

    I do agree his defense is "suspect" - I even say it's horrible but I feel he is improving but most project it's going to be bad next year, too.
    i would trade andujar for hader straight up. but andujar isnt worth anything of value trade wise right now .

  9. #84

    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by hhill View Post
    I like Andujar as well and I agree he might pencil in as DH/1B but I see some issues as well:

    -I don't see Stanton as an everyday outfielder wherein lies competition for the DH role with Andujar . Sanchez needs DH time too. Stanton does not see physically able to get thru a season without significant down time. Then you have Tauchman in left and BG in center which means 2/3 of the outfield is light offensively.
    -Whether Voit or Andujar is at first, it is weak to average defensively.
    -Can Torres play every day shortstop? Does he have the range?
    -What kind of year will Sanchez have, healthwise and offensively?

    Things have to really break right here.
    Stanton will get some DH time when Tauchman plays, BUT I think you save his legs more with full days off where heís available to pinch hit if needed and by taking him out late in games with a lead. Remember none of Stantonís injuries have come from playing OF. That said I fully expect Andujar to give it a try in LF in ST to increase his versatility. And while none of us really want him at 3B itís always an option if he needs a day (Urshela wonít play every game).

    Sanchez doesnít need to DH. Play him less. Heís not better offensively than any of our DH options (Voit, Andujar, Stanton, maybe even Ford) and he benefits from the full rest day more than everyone else. His health is always a big question but weíll get good defense and some nice pop from Higgy as a backup.

    Iím not worried about 1B defense, nice to have but no big deal if weíre subpar there. Andujar is a good enough athlete to possibly be at least average there depending on how quickly he can pickup the position.

    Torres proved he can play SS. Heís not going to win a gold glove but heís middle of the road defensively. Iím not opposed to grabbing a defensive specialist like Hechavarria on a minor league deal for depth with Wade and Thairo though as the primary backups.

  10. #85
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by Ratman View Post
    i would trade andujar for hader straight up. but andujar isnt worth anything of value trade wise right now .
    We can disagree. (we don't need another arm in the pen and will cost a lot)

    FYI. I don't know if this was posted but this is my concern with Andujar and agree with Primetime.

    According to Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic, the Yankees "have been the most active pursuer" of Brewers reliever Josh Hader.
    Rosenthal adds that the Mets and Dodgers have also checked in on the availability of dominant 25-year-old left-hander but says "a deal with any club remains unlikely." Hader owns a 2.42 ERA, 0.85 WHIP, and 349 strikeouts in 204 2/3 career major league innings and he just became arbitration-eligible for the first time, so the Brewers are going to have to be absolutely blown away by an offer to part ways with him this winter.

    RELATED: New York Yankees, Los Angeles Dodgers, New York Mets
    SOURCE: The Athletic
    Dec 12, 2019, 11:04 AM ET

  11. #86

    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by bucky View Post
    We can disagree. (we don't need another arm in the pen and will cost a lot)
    Actually I think we do need another arm perhaps not right now at the start of the season, but after the injuries and disappointing performances hit, its very likely. Even with Cole in the mix we'll want a deeper bullpen in the postseason. Our back-end bullpen is all vulnerable in a 7 game series if we're using them in almost every game especially for the same matchups (guys seeing them often).

    I'd explore Hader now because offseason trade prices tend to be lower than midseason a lot of the time because free agency isn't available midseason as a plan b and because Hader is the best reliever in baseball IMO. I really don't want to lose Andujar though, but from a value standpoint it wouldn't be a bad move. I'd look to replace Andujar's bat though as his style is as you and I both have said is needed in this lineup.

  12. #87
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by primetime714 View Post
    I love Andujar. I think we would've missed him tremendously if not for the emergence of DJL and to a lesser extent Urshela. In 2018 Andujar was the guy that you knew would hurt a strikeout pitcher that attacked the zone. Porcello and Eovaldi dominated our lineup with that recipe in 2018. I guess I'd add the maturation of Torres as another reason we didn't miss Andujar this year. All that said I'm excited to have his style of hitting back in this lineup. I think he's guy that can come up with some big hits for us. I think you spread DJ, Andujar and Urshela across the lineup (top, middle, bottom) and it gives the Yankees a really good mix of hitting styles for pitchers to have to navigate.

    This is my ideal lineup right now:

    DJL- 2B
    Judge- RF
    Torres- SS
    Stanton- LF
    Andujar- DH/1B
    Voit- 1B/DH
    Sanchez- C
    Gardner- CF
    Urshela- 3B

    with Tauchman playing virtually everyday as the 10th man.

    Adding a Scooter Gennett type too would be the icing on the cake. And then you'd just need Wade to backup SS and Higgy to backup C.
    On paper that lineup looks great, but there's way too many Ks in key spots there. When we got Staton everyone was like Murder's Row! In practice though it's how pitchers like Cole rack up huge SO stats.

  13. #88
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by Krall View Post
    On paper that lineup looks great, but there's way too many Ks in key spots there. When we got Staton everyone was like Murder's Row! In practice though it's how pitchers like Cole rack up huge SO stats.
    arent the only guys in that line up who k alot , stanton, judge and sanchez?

  14. #89

    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by Krall View Post
    On paper that lineup looks great, but there's way too many Ks in key spots there. When we got Staton everyone was like Murder's Row! In practice though it's how pitchers like Cole rack up huge SO stats.
    Yes and No. Yes in the sense that if this lineup could use anything its a middle of the order lefthanded beast that could hit in front of Stanton and doesn't strikeout a lot (think of an Anthony Rizzo type as jester suggested in the other thread). So yes some room for improvement.

    No in the sense of DJ, Andujar, Urshela and Gardner are all low strikeout guys. Torres is not high either. DJ is one of the best in baseball at making an impact without striking out very much. You spread those guys out around the lineup and you force opposing pitchers to adjust batter to batter. And yes if you're a strikeout pitcher you may target Stanton as your guy to go after, but if he doesn't chase pitches he's a tough out. Voit and Judge strikeout a lot, but neither chases much and both can hit for average as well as power. Mike Ford is also waiting in the wings as a low-strikeout Voit alternative. Sanchez is an enigma, but at catcher I'll take it.

    Pitchers like Cole dominate everyone, but he's on our side now and gives us an advantage in virtually any game 1 matchup. In the postseason the most fearsome matchups will again probably be the Astros with Verlander and Grienke and maybe someone else emerging as they always seem to have someone. Possibly the Rays with Morton, Snell and Glasnow and maybe the Indians (Bieber, Clevinger, Carrasco, Kluber). And the Dodgers or Nats in the WS. Cole takes one big time opponent out of the mix. This lineup started to get to Verlander a little and had mixed results against Grienke. Morton I'd be afraid of, but if the Rays aren't the wild card or worse we messed up. The Indians guys are good but beatable and they may trade their best position player. And we'll worry about the WS when we get there.

  15. #90

    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by primetime714 View Post
    I love Andujar. I think we would've missed him tremendously if not for the emergence of DJL and to a lesser extent Urshela. In 2018 Andujar was the guy that you knew would hurt a strikeout pitcher that attacked the zone. Porcello and Eovaldi dominated our lineup with that recipe in 2018. I guess I'd add the maturation of Torres as another reason we didn't miss Andujar this year. All that said I'm excited to have his style of hitting back in this lineup. I think he's guy that can come up with some big hits for us. I think you spread DJ, Andujar and Urshela across the lineup (top, middle, bottom) and it gives the Yankees a really good mix of hitting styles for pitchers to have to navigate.

    This is my ideal lineup right now:

    DJL- 2B
    Judge- RF
    Torres- SS
    Stanton- LF
    Andujar- DH/1B
    Voit- 1B/DH
    Sanchez- C
    Gardner- CF
    Urshela- 3B

    with Tauchman playing virtually everyday as the 10th man.

    Adding a Scooter Gennett type too would be the icing on the cake. And then you'd just need Wade to backup SS and Higgy to backup C.
    Hopefully Stanton has shaken the injury bug, I'm not so sure.

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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken711 View Post
    Hopefully Stanton has shaken the injury bug, I'm not so sure.
    i am more concerned about sanchez shaking his injury bug , with him its been multiple years with injuries

    if stanton goes down atleast they have decent outfield depth . but if sanchez goes down who is the back up catcher to higgy?

  17. #92
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken711 View Post
    Hopefully Stanton has shaken the injury bug, I'm not so sure.
    I've been asking the same question since September and still have no answer. What's the story with his knee? Obviously it wasn't nearly 100% when he came back...he couldn't run the bases or in the field at full speed, in fact it was more like 70% speed. Is that what we're looking at for the next 8 years or is he going to be back to normal by ST?
    Let the kids play.

  18. #93
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by Bub View Post
    I've been asking the same question since September and still have no answer. What's the story with his knee? Obviously it wasn't nearly 100% when he came back...he couldn't run the bases or in the field at full speed, in fact it was more like 70% speed. Is that what we're looking at for the next 8 years or is he going to be back to normal by ST?
    well as the old saying goes , no news is good news

  19. #94
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by primetime714 View Post
    Actually I think we do need another arm perhaps not right now at the start of the season, but after the injuries and disappointing performances hit, its very likely. Even with Cole in the mix we'll want a deeper bullpen in the postseason. Our back-end bullpen is all vulnerable in a 7 game series if we're using them in almost every game especially for the same matchups (guys seeing them often).

    I'd explore Hader now because offseason trade prices tend to be lower than midseason a lot of the time because free agency isn't available midseason as a plan b and because Hader is the best reliever in baseball IMO. I really don't want to lose Andujar though, but from a value standpoint it wouldn't be a bad move. I'd look to replace Andujar's bat though as his style is as you and I both have said is needed in this lineup.
    fine. Look Hader is that good. I still can not believe MUL is out there talking but I would too. Hader and Yelich almost got them to WS 2 years ago (it was a great series). We got too many 1 (possibly 2) inning pitchers now. Hader is a closer and we got Chapman and Britton. We need Andujar more because we lost Didi (15% K) and Romine (21%). (I think I ahve to check fangraphs after this) Judge, Stanton, Sanchez, Voit all have above average Ks and league average is 23%. We need 1 long relievers/5th pitcher MORE like German in the pen 4 innings and stop this 1 inning rotation from the 5th inning on. I want an opener, too, for Monty. But don't trade Andujar unless it's for a solid SP. I know Andujar and Hader is being discuss with teams it is not a good fit for us. This of high contact/ low K is to keep Andujar.

    Voit 2018 26% (Ford is at 17%)
    Sanchez 25%
    Last edited by bucky; 12-14-19 at 03:24 PM. Reason: checked fangraph

  20. #95

    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by bucky View Post
    fine. Look Hader is that good. I still can not believe MUL is out there talking but I would too. Hader and Yelich almost got them to WS 2 years ago (it was a great series). We got too many 1 (possibly 2) inning pitchers now. Hader is a closer and we got Chapman and Britton. We need Andujar more because we lost Didi (15% K) and Romine (21%). (I think I ahve to check fangraphs after this) Judge, Stanton, Sanchez, Voit all have above average Ks and league average is 23%. We need 1 long relievers/5th pitcher MORE like German in the pen 4 innings and stop this 1 inning rotation from the 5th inning on. I want an opener, too, for Monty. But don't trade Andujar unless it's for a solid SP. I know Andujar and Hader is being discuss with teams it is not a good fit for us. This of high contact/ low K is to keep Andujar.

    Voit 2018 26% (Ford is at 17%)
    Sanchez 25%
    Hader closes, but he's not a traditional 1 inning reliever he's actually great going 2 innings and even longer in the postseason. The Yankees would be looking to deploy him that way. That's why he's a great fit. I agree we don't need another 1 inning reliever especially with guys like Otto and Kahnle not even going that in the playoffs because of matchups and ineffectiveness.

    I think you make a good case why we might need Andujar more and its a case I just made earlier in this thread, but if you take into account their respective values and how replaceable they are Hader > Andujar. Andujar is a really good hitter without a position, Hader is the best reliever in baseball with no or few equals. If we had to replace Andujar it wouldn't necessarily be easy, but it could be done because he's not exactly a unicorn given his defensive limitations, all bat only guys including ones that don't strike out a lot can be found. Howie Kendrick for example just signed for 6M, granted he's old and signed for under market to stay with the Nats, but it shows you that Andujar's value is not on the same level as Hader.

    And I say all of this as one of the biggest Andujar fans on this forum.

  21. #96
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    IMO the key to Andujar's future with the Yankees is Stanton's future with the Yankees. In other words, if Stanton wasn't here, Miguel would probably be handed the DH role this season.

    OTOH, sometimes I dream about Stanton having another MVP-like season for the Yanks.
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  22. #97
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by Zimmer's Helmet View Post
    The injuries and a major concern, no doubt.
    But I also believe that wholesale changes in training techniques are required.

    Lesser focus on strength-training, and greater focus on agility/flexibility training.

    When I look at Stanton, I have flashbacks of Jack Clark. Same vicious lat-tearing swing.
    Increased muscle leads to a higher likelihood of pulls.

    Personally, where dangerous swings are concerned, Sanchez seems to me to be the team leader, a major oblique tear waiting to happen.

  23. #98
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by primetime714 View Post
    I love Andujar. I think we would've missed him tremendously if not for the emergence of DJL and to a lesser extent Urshela. In 2018 Andujar was the guy that you knew would hurt a strikeout pitcher that attacked the zone. Porcello and Eovaldi dominated our lineup with that recipe in 2018. I guess I'd add the maturation of Torres as another reason we didn't miss Andujar this year. All that said I'm excited to have his style of hitting back in this lineup. I think he's guy that can come up with some big hits for us. I think you spread DJ, Andujar and Urshela across the lineup (top, middle, bottom) and it gives the Yankees a really good mix of hitting styles for pitchers to have to navigate.

    This is my ideal lineup right now:

    DJL- 2B
    Judge- RF
    Torres- SS
    Stanton- LF
    Andujar- DH/1B
    Voit- 1B/DH
    Sanchez- C
    Gardner- CF
    Urshela- 3B

    with Tauchman playing virtually everyday as the 10th man.

    Adding a Scooter Gennett type too would be the icing on the cake. And then you'd just need Wade to backup SS and Higgy to backup C.

    I'm also a big Andujar fan and wish to high heaven the Yankees could find someone to teach him how to get rid of the ball without a double pump.


    This lineup looks very good, although I have two...not reservations but cautions. It seems unsafe to assume Urshela's performance last year, or Tauchman's, are necessarily repeatable. If they can do it, fantastic. However, I suspect there are a lot of AL people who are from Missouri when it comes to Urshela as a high-average hitter.

  24. #99
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by primetime714 View Post
    I love Andujar. I think we would've missed him tremendously if not for the emergence of DJL and to a lesser extent Urshela. In 2018 Andujar was the guy that you knew would hurt a strikeout pitcher that attacked the zone. Porcello and Eovaldi dominated our lineup with that recipe in 2018. I guess I'd add the maturation of Torres as another reason we didn't miss Andujar this year. All that said I'm excited to have his style of hitting back in this lineup. I think he's guy that can come up with some big hits for us. I think you spread DJ, Andujar and Urshela across the lineup (top, middle, bottom) and it gives the Yankees a really good mix of hitting styles for pitchers to have to navigate.

    This is my ideal lineup right now:

    DJL- 2B
    Judge- RF
    Torres- SS
    Stanton- LF
    Andujar- DH/1B
    Voit- 1B/DH
    Sanchez- C
    Gardner- CF
    Urshela- 3B

    with Tauchman playing virtually everyday as the 10th man.

    Adding a Scooter Gennett type too would be the icing on the cake. And then you'd just need Wade to backup SS and Higgy to backup C.
    This is a great lineup. Hope we see it almost every game.

  25. #100
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    Re: Next order of business: We need a high contact/ low K hitter

    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    IMO the key to Andujar's future with the Yankees is Stanton's future with the Yankees. In other words, if Stanton wasn't here, Miguel would probably be handed the DH role this season.

    OTOH, sometimes I dream about Stanton having another MVP-like season for the Yanks.
    Hopefully this will be the season Stanton gives us that MVP season.

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