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  1. #651
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    “Players were not given the latest state of the rules,” said Boras, who represents three current Astros — second baseman José Altuve and right-handers Lance McCullers and Aaron Sanchez. “To suggest players violated rules that were withheld from them is a false incrimination of players.”
    Ignorance of the rule is not a defense.
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  2. #652
    NYYF Cy Young


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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    But it was reported by Jack Curry on YES that they took the monitor off the wall when they were afraid they were going to get caught and replaced it with a portable one! That sure doesn’t sound like ignorance!

  3. #653
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ZIM 2002 View Post
    But it was reported by Jack Curry on YES that they took the monitor off the wall when they were afraid they were going to get caught and replaced it with a portable one! That sure doesn’t sound like ignorance!

    They addressed that, and I still don't agree with him.

    • The “panic” in the Astros’ dugout after White Sox pitcher Danny Farquhar appeared to notice the banging trash-can sound the Astros used to identify the coming pitch to their hitters.

    • The players’ removal of the monitor from the wall in the tunnel and the hiding of it in an office before the end of each game.

    • Hinch’s damage to the monitor on two occasions, which signaled his disapproval of the system even though he admitted he did not stop it or notify players that he wanted them to stop.“Many of the players who were interviewed admitted that they knew the scheme was wrong because it crossed the line from what the player believed was fair competition and/or violated MLB rules,” Manfred said. “Players stated that if manager AJ Hinch told them to stop engaging in the conduct, they would have immediately stopped.”

    To Boras, therein lies the problem.

    Players, Boras said, “follow the authority given from their managers, coaches, general managers and the organization. If the perception was that it was disallowed, then the players clearly would not have done it because they would have understood the rule.

    “This is no different than PEDs,” Boras continued, referring to baseball’s crackdown on performance-enhancing drugs. “The minute we legislated a compendium of specificity, players were on notice. And then the accountability went directly to them. And it should.”
    Jaret Wright's 2005 Cy Young Season: 20-3, 3.04 ERA

  4. #654
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ZIM 2002 View Post
    But it was reported by Jack Curry on YES that they took the monitor off the wall when they were afraid they were going to get caught and replaced it with a portable one! That sure doesn’t sound like ignorance!
    They could have thought what they were doing was legal but didn't want other teams to know they were doing it, or do it to them. Basically, they could have believed they were operating in a grey area that wasn't explicitly illegal.

    They wouldn't have wanted other teams to know that, or exploit the same "loophole" so they hid it.
    Calmer than you are

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  5. #655
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    “Players were not given the latest state of the rules,” said Boras, who represents three current Astros — second baseman José Altuve and right-handers Lance McCullers and Aaron Sanchez. “To suggest players violated rules that were withheld from them is a false incrimination of players.”



    Seriously? Are we talking about Kindergarteners here, who must be told the classroom rules?

    One should seek and know all the rules/regulations that he is bounded by the profession he is practicing.

    30 teams and they're the only ones banging a trash can. Not one Astros player wondered and checked on "the latest state of the rules"? BS statement/excuse by their agent.

  6. #656

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Agent Scott Boras does not believe the Astros’ players should apologize
    Well I agree with him on this. They shouldn't apologize. Because they're not sorry.

  7. #657

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Mxylsplk View Post
    Well I agree with him on this. They shouldn't apologize. Because they're not sorry.
    I’m sorry and won’t do it again... until next time. Then I’ll say I’m sorry.
    "It is almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is playing golf." -Robert Wilson Lynd



  8. #658
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Mxylsplk View Post
    Well I agree with him on this. They shouldn't apologize. Because they're not sorry.
    Yup. And, they're not sorry because they haven't been punished, and won't be punished.

    The Commissioner let them all off, Scot free. What should have been a scandal for a single team is now a blemish on the entire game. You had one job........

    "But what people tend to forget...is that being a Yankee is as much about character as it is about performance; as much about who you are as what you do."
    - President Barack Obama

  9. #659
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by Maynerd View Post
    Yup. And, they're not sorry because they haven't been punished, and won't be punished.

    The Commissioner let them all off, Scot free. What should have been a scandal for a single team is now a blemish on the entire game. You had one job........
    We had the steroids commissioner and now we have the cheaters commissioner.

  10. #660
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ClownPickle View Post
    They could have thought what they were doing was legal but didn't want other teams to know they were doing it, or do it to them. Basically, they could have believed they were operating in a grey area that wasn't explicitly illegal.

    They wouldn't have wanted other teams to know that, or exploit the same "loophole" so they hid it.
    Dude.

  11. #661

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Kind of reminds me of that Seinfeld episode where George bangs the cleaning lady on his desk and subsequently gets fired for it.

    "I'm sorry. I didn't realize that sort of thing was frowned upon."

    Only thing is, George did apologize.
    Ask me about my groin pull.

  12. #662
    Wants 2 be your latex salesman
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by Archer1979 View Post
    Kind of reminds me of that Seinfeld episode where George bangs the cleaning lady on his desk and subsequently gets fired for it.

    "I'm sorry. I didn't realize that sort of thing was frowned upon."

    Only thing is, George did apologize.
    "Was that wrong?"
    "This game has a heartbeat, Brian." -- Joe Torre

  13. #663
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by Archer1979 View Post
    Kind of reminds me of that Seinfeld episode where George bangs the cleaning lady on his desk and subsequently gets fired for it.

    "I'm sorry. I didn't realize that sort of thing was frowned upon."

    Only thing is, George did apologize.
    George also admitted he was not a marine biologist after he saved a whale.

  14. #664
    Wants 2 be your latex salesman
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    George also admitted he was not a marine biologist after he saved a whale.
    The sea was angry that day, my friends -- like an old man sending back soup at a deli.
    "This game has a heartbeat, Brian." -- Joe Torre

  15. #665
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Dallas Keuchel had this to say about Fiers,

    "It sucks to the extent of that the clubhouse rule was broken...I mean and that's where I'll go with that. I don't have much else to say about Mike...I can only speak for myself but just knowing some of those guys over there and knowing how they are as people, we're all people to an extent, I mean, some guys are robots, I'll tell you that...But for most of us, the human element is real. And a lot of guys are not happy with the fact that Mike came out and said something or the fact that this even happened."

    As a fan, I'm glad Fiers spoke up. As for Keuchel and any of these other cheaters who are mad at Fiers, you would do well to examine your collective consciences.
    Yankee fan living in Maine.

  16. #666

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by apalradio View Post
    Dallas Keuchel had this to say about Fiers,

    "It sucks to the extent of that the clubhouse rule was broken...I mean and that's where I'll go with that. I don't have much else to say about Mike...I can only speak for myself but just knowing some of those guys over there and knowing how they are as people, we're all people to an extent, I mean, some guys are robots, I'll tell you that...But for most of us, the human element is real. And a lot of guys are not happy with the fact that Mike came out and said something or the fact that this even happened."

    As a fan, I'm glad Fiers spoke up. As for Keuchel and any of these other cheaters who are mad at Fiers, you would do well to examine your collective consciences.
    Spot on. Had Fiers said nothing the Astros would now be working on even better ways to cheat.
    "It is almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is playing golf." -Robert Wilson Lynd



  17. #667
    New Murderer's Row False1's Avatar
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by Blazer View Post
    Spot on. Had Fiers said nothing the Astros would now be working on even better ways to cheat.
    Anyone who besmirches Fiers will be persona non grata with this baseball fan immediately. Jessica Mendoza, Pedro Martinez, etc. It's not like he went public with embarrassing off-the-field information about specific teammates. Yeah, what happens in the clubhouse stays in the clubhouse has boundaries. Like technology-aided systemic cheating.

  18. #668

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Another thing that gets forgotten is that four other people who were with the Astros in 2017 also came forward in the same Athletic article, and another MLB manager was quoted also, but because Fiers was the only one to put his name to the accusation, he appears to be the only one catching flak
    "My guys are savages in the box!" - Aaron Boone

  19. #669
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by apalradio View Post
    Dallas Keuchel had this to say about Fiers,

    "It sucks to the extent of that the clubhouse rule was broken...I mean and that's where I'll go with that. I don't have much else to say about Mike...I can only speak for myself but just knowing some of those guys over there and knowing how they are as people, we're all people to an extent, I mean, some guys are robots, I'll tell you that...But for most of us, the human element is real. And a lot of guys are not happy with the fact that Mike came out and said something or the fact that this even happened."

    As a fan, I'm glad Fiers spoke up. As for Keuchel and any of these other cheaters who are mad at Fiers, you would do well to examine your collective consciences.
    Keuchel blamed the whistleblower, period. 😂
    "Be a voice, not an echo." - Albert Einstein

  20. #670

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    Anyone who besmirches Fiers will be persona non grata with this baseball fan immediately. Jessica Mendoza, Pedro Martinez, etc. It's not like he went public with embarrassing off-the-field information about specific teammates. Yeah, what happens in the clubhouse stays in the clubhouse has boundaries. Like technology-aided systemic cheating.
    The days of clubhouse secrecy ended with Jim Bouton.
    "It is almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is playing golf." -Robert Wilson Lynd



  21. #671
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation



    Jaret Wright's 2005 Cy Young Season: 20-3, 3.04 ERA

  22. #672
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    These old quotes are great.

    The Red Sox believe the Astros were snooping to unlawfully gain intelligence. Outraged, the Astros countered by saying that their close-range dugout photography simply was their defending against potentially cheating rivals, ensuring that the Red Sox—and others—weren't using dugout video monitors to steal signs from Houston.

    Days later, the Red Sox watched the Dodgers' Manny Machado waving like an air traffic controller from second base during the fourth inning of Game 2 of the World Series and accused him of relaying signs.

    "The paranoia is off the charts," Astros ace Justin Verlander says. "You saw that last year with us. People thought we were doing something. We were trying to make sure the Indians weren't doing anything. That was just us being paranoid."
    "Look at the talent in this clubhouse, and you tell me," Correa says in defending the Astros. "We're great hitters all the way around. We work hard every day, and the fact that people try to take that credit away from us is disrespect to our abilities.
    "I think it's unfair to say we've been the face of any of this, the Astros," Houston manager AJ Hinch says. "It was very public for us. We admitted our mistakes of trying to make sure that other teams were not breaking the rules, and in turn we were the ones that had the unfortunate incident in Cleveland and then in Boston. Everyone learned from their mistakes.

    "It's a topic around the league. I think it's unfair to think that we are the only team that has been curious about everybody else's actions. Fortunately, MLB took a very serious stance on it, and I think it's been largely cleaned up over the year."
    Former Yankees manager Joe Girardi is among those who advocate incorporating NFL-style earpiece-and-microphone systems that could be used for communication between third base coaches and hitters and catchers and pitchers.

    "They do that in college," Cora says. "At some time, we will. That might happen."

    Cora pauses, grins and continues: "But then somebody's going to crack that code and probably hitters will be listening [in on pitcher-catcher discussions]. It's kind of like drug-testing. Chemists say [the cheats] are always one step ahead. It's kind of the same thing here."
    https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...-sign-stealing

    ...Cora legit such a dirtbag.
    Calmer than you are

    7/30/2017: The day the Minnesota Twins bought a prospect from the New York Yankees.

  23. #673
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post
    Keuchel blamed the whistleblower, period. 😂
    There's a lot of that going around.

  24. #674
    NYYF Cy Young


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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Keuchel also apparently said something to the effect that they weren’t doing it all the time, which Joel Sherman responded to somewhere. Talk about dumb comments!

  25. #675
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ZIM 2002 View Post
    Keuchel also apparently said something to the effect that they weren’t doing it all the time, which Joel Sherman responded to somewhere. Talk about dumb comments!
    Sherman's response was great.

    Jaret Wright's 2005 Cy Young Season: 20-3, 3.04 ERA

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