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  1. #451
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    Messerwhitescooter's Avatar
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by kan_t View Post
    One interesting thing is that back before the scandal was exposed, Darvish spent a lot time to study his WS game 7 performance and concluded in his YouTube channel that he found nothing about tipping his pitches like the Astros claimed. It's at Dodgers stadium but it makes me wonder if the Astros also cheat in away game.
    I would not be at all surprised.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubeFmHEVzQ0

  2. #452
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by Messerwhitescooter View Post
    I would not be at all surprised.
    Would have been pretty hard to set something up at an NL park that the Astros would rarely play at.

  3. #453
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by BabyBombers View Post
    Cole?

    I always thought about this but I am very happy we got Cole. If you remember how we posted the big jump in his spin rate when he went to Astros from Pirates (good pitching coach) and it was assumed the HOU used high tech videos to improve the techniques. I don't want to divert this thread but personally, I look at tar for a pitcher the same as using it for the batter.

  4. #454
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    Would have been pretty hard to set something up at an NL park that the Astros would rarely play at.
    Really? I wonder. Visiting teams have access to camera feeds for challenge evaluation purposes, and, of course, presumably, garbage cans. The difficulty is getting someone watching the live feed and communicating the sign to the dugout for relay to the batter. Depending on how the innards of the park is laid out, it doesn't seem that hard to do. Some parks might be harder than others. The risk of discovery might be greater as support staff paid by the home team might notice something, but maybe worth it for a WS game.

    Elsewhere, a thoughtful column by Jeff Passan on MLB's 'whitewash' of the whole thing.

    https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/...ng-punishments

    Worth a read.
    "Deep to left! Yastrzemski will not get it! It's a home run! A three-run homer by Bucky Dent! And the Yankees now lead by a score of 3-2!" - New York Yankees announcer Bill White (October 2, 1978)

  5. #455

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    None of us are fooled about Crane firing Lunhow/Hinch, right? Clearly MLB wanted him to do that and it was probably discussed.
    Thank you for making me calm today, Brett Gardner

  6. #456
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by snapple View Post
    None of us are fooled about Crane firing Lunhow/Hinch, right? Clearly MLB wanted him to do that and it was probably discussed.
    Fooled how? Those are pretty big losses organizationally, and probably the thing that will have the most adverse impact on the club moving forward.
    Calmer than you are

    7/30/2017: The day the Minnesota Twins bought a prospect from the New York Yankees.

  7. #457

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ClownPickle View Post
    Fooled how? Those are pretty big losses organizationally, and probably the thing that will have the most adverse impact on the club moving forward.
    That Crane fired them of his own volition.
    Thank you for making me calm today, Brett Gardner

  8. #458
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by snapple View Post
    That Crane fired them of his own volition.
    i'm not even sold he wasn't aware. he maintains 2017 wasn't tainted... really dude... T-A-I-N-T-E-D.

  9. #459
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by snapple View Post
    That Crane fired them of his own volition.
    Probably. It was in his best interest politically/organizationally to do so. I don't give Crane props for firing those guys.
    Calmer than you are

    7/30/2017: The day the Minnesota Twins bought a prospect from the New York Yankees.

  10. #460

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ClownPickle View Post
    Probably. It was in his best interest politically/organizationally to do so. I don't give Crane props for doing so.
    Manfred wants this story to go away as fast as possible, so It feels like, to me, he probably talked to Crane and said something to the effect of ďIíll give the suspensions, then youíll fire them and save some face for your teamĒ.

    But yeah, weird conspiracy aside, Iím with you.
    Thank you for making me calm today, Brett Gardner

  11. #461

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Vacate the title. Vacate the MVP.

    Astros should have ZERO championships to hang onto right now.

    That would be devastating.

    We all know the Astros will be another 100 win team again next season. These punishments do nothing.
    The Continuance of Being Great, is Getting Number Twenty-Eight

  12. #462

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ClownPickle View Post
    Agreed. In addition, Trevor Bauer firmly believes the Astros haven't been playing fair in regards to their pitcher's spin rate increases. I doubt we'll get anything further on that from MLB, as pine tar seems to be this unspoken thing pitchers are allowed to cheat with. However, I really hope the Yankees did their due diligence in regards to Cole prior to signing.

    I hope Cole teaches his new teammates his secrets

  13. #463
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    Snatch Catch's Avatar
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Jaret Wright's 2005 Cy Young Season: 20-3, 3.04 ERA

  14. #464
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Wonder if they'll get in trouble for that after Manfred memo sent out for teams not to address.
    Calmer than you are

    7/30/2017: The day the Minnesota Twins bought a prospect from the New York Yankees.

  15. #465
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ClownPickle View Post
    Wonder if they'll get in trouble for that after Manfred memo sent out for teams not to address.
    me thinks yes

  16. #466
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ClownPickle View Post
    Wonder if they'll get in trouble for that after Manfred memo sent out for teams not to address.
    Manfred probably just added them to the list of teams to be shutdown.
    If they ask who was our star, give them 25 names, and if you forget our names, just tell them we were Yankees.

  17. #467
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by CalYankeeFan View Post
    Manfred probably just added them to the list of teams to be shutdown.
    Staten Island already on that list.

  18. #468
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ymike673 View Post
    Staten Island already on that list.
    Bummer. My local team is too.
    If they ask who was our star, give them 25 names, and if you forget our names, just tell them we were Yankees.

  19. #469
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by CalYankeeFan View Post
    Bummer. My local team is too.
    Yankees are fighting it. The other 41 teams are putting pressure on their congressmen to end MLBs anti trust exemption if they go through with this.

  20. #470

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    I'm going to disagree with everyone here who has said the (weak) punishments made the cheating "worth it". For instance,

    Quote Originally Posted by BabyBombers View Post
    Sounds like cheating is still worth it to me.
    Sorry, it's not worth it. 2017 HOU will not be known as WS champions. They will be known as cheaters. They don't have a WS win, they have a tainted label. The two aren't the same.

    I'd rather have a "good" competitive 2017 season in which I didn't win, than be known as the 2017 Houston Astros. They are toxic, and they will live on in infamy.

    If what they have is winning, I don't want anything to do with it, and neither should you.

  21. #471
    Hemi-Goodness DrNick's Avatar
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Oh Alex...I guess it was easier than what you were letting on...

    https://twitter.com/ac13alex/status/...widget%3DTweet
    Quote Originally Posted by DEADSOX
    We won, stop bitching. Bitches.
    **This Space For Rent**

  22. #472

    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by ClownPickle View Post
    Agreed. In addition, Trevor Bauer firmly believes the Astros haven't been playing fair in regards to their pitcher's spin rate increases. I doubt we'll get anything further on that from MLB, as pine tar seems to be this unspoken thing pitchers are allowed to cheat with. However, I really hope the Yankees did their due diligence in regards to Cole prior to signing.
    With Morton having the year that he had in Tampa helps alleviate some of my concerns with how Cole will transition to pitching in a different organization other than Houston. Oh, and no more Larry helps as well.

  23. #473
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by albo4lyfe View Post
    With Morton having the year that he had in Tampa helps alleviate some of my concerns with how Cole will transition to pitching in a different organization other than Houston. Oh, and no more Larry helps as well.
    Good point, and as long as it is legal, I doubt Cole will incorporate whatever he learned into his routine in NY. Maybe it will even help the staff as a whole.
    If they ask who was our star, give them 25 names, and if you forget our names, just tell them we were Yankees.

  24. #474
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    Re: Astros cheating investigation

    Quote Originally Posted by albo4lyfe View Post
    With Morton having the year that he had in Tampa helps alleviate some of my concerns with how Cole will transition to pitching in a different organization other than Houston. Oh, and no more Larry helps as well.
    Morton is different though. Morton didn't have a jump in spin rate with Houston, which is associated with a substance. Morton's highest 4 seam spin rate was actually with the Phillies in 16'. He had a jump in velocity, and again that was actually with the Phillies.

    https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savan...r-pitching-mlb

    Cole is a COMPLETELY different animal. His 4 season fastball spin rate went from 2017 (2164 ) > 2018 (2379) > 2019 (2530). Part of that is probably related to the velocity increase, but not all of it.

    https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savan...r-pitching-mlb
    Calmer than you are

    7/30/2017: The day the Minnesota Twins bought a prospect from the New York Yankees.

  25. #475
    NYYF Cy Young


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    Re: Astros cheating investigation


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