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  1. #1551
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    I don't mind candidates "borrowing" from dropped out candidates. Let's get the best platform possible regardless of who wins the nomination.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  2. #1552
    Let's go Rangers! RhodyYanksFan's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Just drop out Joe. You're too out of touch.

    https://www.vox.com/2019/9/5/2085000...ers-and-losers

    Joe Biden’s big moment at the CNN town hall was not one he was hoping for: He was called out for planning to attend a Thursday campaign fundraiser co-hosted by Andrew Goldman, who helped found the natural gas company Western LNG.

    Although Goldman isn’t technically a fossil fuel executive and isn’t part of day-to-day operations at the company, Biden said he’d consider pulling out of the fundraiser if there was more of a link between the two. But even a whiff of coziness between Biden and someone with ties to a fossil fuel company won’t make climate activists happy. (Immediately after the debate, Sunrise called on Biden to cancel the fundraiser.)


    Compared to Warren and Sanders, the former vice president and current Democratic frontrunner didn’t offer a clear vision on climate. Biden gave long and often rambling answers about his climate plan, noting that climate groups gave it a “B+ or beyond.” He declined to join some of his opponents in supporting a nationwide ban on fracking. And he kept returning to the point that his experience talking to world leaders as Obama’s vice president would help him build an international climate coalition. In doing so, Biden seemed to suggest that whatever the US did to decarbonize ultimately wouldn’t matter if the rest of the world didn’t follow the lead.

    “The fact of the matter is that we make up 15 percent of the problem. The rest of the world makes up 80, 85 percent of the problem,” Biden said. “If we did everything perfectly — and we must and should in order to get other countries to move — we still have to get the rest of the world to come along and the fact of the matter is we have to up the ante considerably.” —Ella Nilsen

  3. #1553
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    This is a typical tweet about the Amazon fires (I don't call them wildfires; there is nothing wild about them. The Amazon doesn't burn unless you deliberately kill it first, unlike temperate/Arctic forests):

    Kamala Harris@SenKamalaHarris
    ·
    3m
    The ongoing damage to the Amazon rainforest will have horrifying consequences for the world.

    My colleagues and I are demanding the U.S. postpone all trade negotiations with Brazil until President Bolsonaro fully enforces his country’s environmental laws.
    ...which is fine, but missed a larger point. The economic genesis of this year's bump in deforestation is largely due to increased demand for Brazilian soy and other ag products due to Trump's ridiculous tariff war with China. Undoing the tariffs won't fix this, either. Once these acres are in production, they will price to keep these sales away from American farmers. The screwing he is doing to the rainforest and American farmers is permanent, and most Americans have no clue this linkage exists.

    Dems should be campaigning on this.
    "Deep to left! Yastrzemski will not get it! It's a home run! A three-run homer by Bucky Dent! And the Yankees now lead by a score of 3-2!" - New York Yankees announcer Bill White (October 2, 1978)

  4. #1554
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by theDurk View Post
    This is a typical tweet about the Amazon fires (I don't call them wildfires; there is nothing wild about them. The Amazon doesn't burn unless you deliberately kill it first, unlike temperate/Arctic forests):



    ...which is fine, but missed a larger point. The economic genesis of this year's bump in deforestation is largely due to increased demand for Brazilian soy and other ag products due to Trump's ridiculous tariff war with China. Undoing the tariffs won't fix this, either. Once these acres are in production, they will price to keep these sales away from American farmers. The screwing he is doing to the rainforest and American farmers is permanent, and most Americans have no clue this linkage exists.

    Dems should be campaigning on this.
    John Delaney is but the only one I have seen so far.
    The sky is falling! We are doomed!

  5. #1555
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeePride1967 View Post
    John Delaney is but the only one I have seen so far.
    Who is John Delaney?
    "Deep to left! Yastrzemski will not get it! It's a home run! A three-run homer by Bucky Dent! And the Yankees now lead by a score of 3-2!" - New York Yankees announcer Bill White (October 2, 1978)

  6. #1556
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by theDurk View Post
    Who is John Delaney?
    Good point. But one is. Though clearly the wrong one.
    The sky is falling! We are doomed!

  7. #1557
    Let's go Rangers! RhodyYanksFan's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Does anybody here know anybody who is pulling for Biden? I don't get it.

    https://morningconsult.com/wp-conten...nce-9.9.19.pdf


  8. #1558
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by RhodyYanksFan View Post
    Does anybody here know anybody who is pulling for Biden? I don't get it.

    https://morningconsult.com/wp-conten...nce-9.9.19.pdf

    People support Biden for all sorts of negative reasons. He's not too far left, or a woman of color, not an inexperienced newcomer, not Trump, not going to alienate Trump Democrats (whoever they are).
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  9. #1559
    Let's go Rangers! RhodyYanksFan's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Yes, let's base the entire campaign on winning back these people. The ones who seem to prefer the most racist version of Trump.


  10. #1560
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    People support Biden for all sorts of negative reasons. He's not too far left, or a woman of color, not an inexperienced newcomer, not Trump, not going to alienate Trump Democrats (whoever they are).
    I'm not surprised Biden tracks well with those least interested in politics. The primary season hasn't heated up yet, and he's the most recognizable name in the field.

    Meanwhile, Gallup has Bernie with the highest favorability rating of any candidate and is within striking distance of the lead in New Hampshire and Iowa.

    Biden may have peaked already.
    Jingoism is not Patriotism

  11. #1561

    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyler Durden View Post
    I'm not surprised Biden tracks well with those least interested in politics. The primary season hasn't heated up yet, and he's the most recognizable name in the field.

    Meanwhile, Gallup has Bernie with the highest favorability rating of any candidate and is within striking distance of the lead in New Hampshire and Iowa.

    Biden may have peaked already.
    Warren has been rising steadily in the polls, too.

  12. #1562
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by jlw1980 View Post
    Warren has been rising steadily in the polls, too.
    True, which is another reason why it's possible Biden may have nowhere to go but down.
    Jingoism is not Patriotism

  13. #1563

    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/10/jim-...e-stopped.html

    Cramer: Wall Street executives are saying Elizabeth Warren’s 2020 bid has ‘got to be stopped’

    Leaders in the financial industry are really worried about the possibility of Sen. Elizabeth Warren becoming president, CNBC’s Jim Cramer said Tuesday.

    “When you get off the desk and talk to executives, they’re more fearful of her winning,” Cramer said on “Squawk on the Street.” Cramer said he’s hearing a “she’s got to be stopped” mantra bubbling up among executives on Wall Street and elsewhere.
    Warren is a “very compelling figure on the stump,” Cramer said, predicting that she’s going to win the first-in-the nation nominating contest in Iowa, set be held Feb. 3, 2020. “It would be a suboptimal situation for the banks” if Warren were to win the Democratic nomination, he added. President Donald Trump, while facing a few primary challengers, is expected to easily win the Republican presidential nomination.
    She retweeted this article, saying "I'm Elizabeth Warren and I approve of this message."

  14. #1564
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by jlw1980 View Post
    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/10/jim-...e-stopped.html

    Cramer: Wall Street executives are saying Elizabeth Warren’s 2020 bid has ‘got to be stopped’

    She retweeted this article, saying "I'm Elizabeth Warren and I approve of this message."
    I saw that on Twitter and chuckled - perfect set up for her. If she were the nominee, and the economy really started to slide during the campaign, it would probably be the end of Trump.

  15. #1565
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Elizabeth Warren finally updated her website to include her views on healthcare and... it's not great. It does not rule out insurers being allowed to exist as gatekeeping middlemen. Also, leaving mental health conditions vulnerable to private insurers doesn't really seem justifiable. I'm sure that won't result in prohibitively expensive policies for one of our most vulnerable populations at all!

    She also directly contradicted herself from a little over a day before releasing it.



    This is a huge issue because this position entrenches the backwards thinking that's influencing treatment and forcing science to remain static. We understand mental issues to be far more of a spectrum than distinct disorders, since we keep seeing comorbidity within those disorders. As long as private insurers keep demanding a specific diagnosis and specific treatment windows, there's no way the DSM will update in the comprehensive fashion it needs. Seriously and genuinely, I am disappointed that someone whose branding and background is all about academics to put out a plan that disregards current science and knowledge in order to keep a regressive, parasitic industry alive.

    If you're going to explicitly leave one kind of insurance out of single payer, dental insurance makes way more sense, since it's already separate from general health insurance, there would be a much larger pool of clients to bring costs down, other single payer systems like Canada leave it out, and most people will only use dental for two cleanings a year, while mental health patients will use more time and cost intensive services more often.

    Warren's plan doesn't even mention whether or not it covers prescription drugs. It talks about bringing down prescription costs in the context of family affordability, which would imply no, but for some reason she never explicitly states that she wouldn't cover prescriptions. Feels like that ambiguity is also intentional.
    Last edited by trapper700; 09-13-19 at 04:08 AM.

  16. #1566

    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    I disagree with your interpretation of her healthcare page. The first section supports M4A. Full stop. No caveats. No insurers. Just M4A. Her interview with Ady Barkan reinforces that.

    Elizabeth supports Medicare for All, which would provide all Americans with a public health care program. Medicare for All is the best way to give every single person in this country a guarantee of high-quality health care. Everybody is covered. Nobody goes broke because of a medical bill. No more fighting with insurance companies.
    The section on mental health is about the Behavioral Health Coverage Transparency Act which addresses mental health coverage now. It's a solid bill that will help people that currently need help. M4A will be great but it's not here now and people that are in need should not just be expected to sit back and wait for it while congress twiddles their thumbs. I'm sure that is why Bernie is also sponsoring that bill. Same thing with the Affordable Drug Manufacturing Act , another bill she has put forward to help people in need right now.

    I think it's extremely important to try to get something done to help people currently in need instead of just twiddling her thumbs and waiting for M4A to become reality. Kudos to both her and Bernie for recognizing that.
    Take car. Go to Mum's. Kill Phil - "Sorry." - grab Liz, go to the Winchester, have a nice cold pint, and wait for all of this to blow over. How's that for a slice of fried gold?

  17. #1567
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    So Joe Biden thinks that addressing "institutional segregation" involves having white people teach black people how to raise their kids better. Black parents need to turn the record player on at night.

  18. #1568
    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    So Joe Biden thinks that addressing "institutional segregation" involves having white people teach black people how to raise their kids better. Black parents need to turn the record player on at night.
    I hope that gets the push back it deserves but I don't think it will.

  19. #1569
    Let's go Rangers! RhodyYanksFan's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    So Joe Biden thinks that addressing "institutional segregation" involves having white people teach black people how to raise their kids better. Black parents need to turn the record player on at night.
    I thought Castro's line about "did you just forget what you said 2 minutes ago" was a little harsh and doing the GOPs job for them....but that exchange about systemic racism and segregation was really brutal.

  20. #1570
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    So tired of Biden and Warren, they’re traditional politicians. Dull, boring and uninspired, and they’re not beating Trump.

    Sanders is alright but I’d rather have Andrew Yang.

  21. #1571
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by Vin View Post
    So tired of Biden and Warren, they’re traditional politicians. Dull, boring and uninspired, and they’re not beating Trump.

    Sanders is alright but I’d rather have Andrew Yang.
    I don't understand why being a politician who understands politics and can do politics is a bad thing for being in charge of a political process. I want my doctor to be a professional doctor, and my dentist to be a professional dentist, and my accountant to be a professional accountant. I also like it when the most important politicians are professional politicians.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  22. #1572
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    I haven't seen the whole thing yet, but for the first half, the best moment was Beto talking about gun buybacks and biggest cringe was Yang's line about being Asian so he knows a lot of doctors.

    I was glad to hear Warren call out Biden about insurance. Yes, most people like their doctors, but nobody likes their insurance. To say that M4A will take away your insurance as if that's bad, is silly.

    However, this is entirely too complex to explain in 75 seconds, which is what they're limited to on a debate stage. Biden was right to call out Bernie and Liz for how those costs will be paid for. I don't buy Liz's argument that middle class costs will go down. There has to be tax increases to offset the cost to the government, but it I feel for many people it'll be a wash since what we used to pay in premium, deductible, copay, prescriptions, supplemental, etc will all be rolled into higher taxes, minus the headache of dealing with insurance saying no and the little thing of never having to worry about going bankrupt.

  23. #1573

    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    So Joe Biden thinks that addressing "institutional segregation" involves having white people teach black people how to raise their kids better. Black parents need to turn the record player on at night.
    Yeah, that was... yikes.

  24. #1574
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    I don't understand why being a politician who understands politics and can do politics is a bad thing for being in charge of a political process. I want my doctor to be a professional doctor, and my dentist to be a professional dentist, and my accountant to be a professional accountant. I also like it when the most important politicians are professional politicians.
    You mean career politicians who really have nothing new to add, stuck in the quagmire of appeasing the corporations who donated large sums of money on their campaign, etc...Same old cycle of red tape. I’m realistic, Trump’s gonna win again unless they have a fresh face and fresh voice that will breathe life into their party.

    One of the things I like about Yang is he’s the only Democrat to appear at Ben Shapiro’s show and talked about solutions and there’s not one single negative comment on Trump.

  25. #1575
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vin View Post
    You mean career politicians who really have nothing new to add, stuck in the quagmire of appeasing the corporations who donated large sums of money on their campaign, etc...Same old cycle of red tape. I’m realistic, Trump’s gonna win again unless they have a fresh face and fresh voice that will breathe life into their party.
    That doesn’t describe, say, Sanders or Warren at all.

    Also, you understand that you’re making precisely the pro-Trump argument, right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vin View Post
    One of the things I like about Yang is he’s the only Democrat to appear at Ben Shapiro’s show and talked about solutions and there’s not one single negative comment on Trump.
    Lots of candidates have talked about solutions. I see nothing particularly positive about Ben Shapiro's show, or about failing to criticize Trump.

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