+ Reply to Thread
Page 1090 of 1221 FirstFirst ... 90 590 990 1040 1080 1087 1088 1089 1090 1091 1092 1093 1100 1140 1190 ... LastLast
Results 27,226 to 27,250 of 30523
  1. #27226

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeter99 View Post
    We still don't have a 3rd baseman.
    Yes we do. He almost won ROY last year as a 22 year old. Miggy doubles is here to stay.
    The Continuance of Being Great, is Getting Number Twenty-Eight

  2. #27227

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    Perhaps Machado should be betting on this himself, to help make up for the lower contract $$ he's inevitably going to sign
    Then wouldnt he bet on the worse odds and make more money?
    The Continuance of Being Great, is Getting Number Twenty-Eight

  3. #27228
    Forum Regular
    Greenwave81's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Jefferson City, Missouri

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by J-Rhod0406 View Post
    Baseball is in bad shape if we are having spring training starting today and there are so many free agents still out there.
    Why is that necessarily so?

    Teams, players, leagues, bargaining agreements etc all change over time based on experience etc.

    Maybe, teams have now realized that 10 yr deals rarely work out great from an investment perspective on their part. Yet some players are still looking for a 10 yr guaranteed security deal when perhaps that time has 'passed'?

    I am certain that Harper and Machado are aware of what Cano, Stanton etc have gotten out of owners over the past years...but every year isn't like the rest. If they were FA 2-5 yrs ago, I am sure that they probably would have got the contract they now want now. But now there is history or a track record of the success/failure of these long-term deals and the owners seem hesitant to offer them (and I can't blame them).

    Every contract has risk associated with it, and in the past that risk was largely assumed by the owners (lack of team opt-outs for non-performance, injury/illness, change in CBA parameters etc). I believe those times have changed.

    This is where players agents, and players themselves, need to be creative. IMO, they are going to have to assume more of the risk to some degree in any contract going forward. Higher upfront salaries say in the beginning yrs of a long-term contract, then including both player and team opt outs would be the way to start.

  4. #27229

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Mixwell View Post
    Call me crazy, but I thought maximizing your chances of winning the World Series was the primary goal. It was George's, anyway.
    George who?

  5. #27230

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Greenwave81 View Post
    Why is that necessarily so?

    Teams, players, leagues, bargaining agreements etc all change over time based on experience etc.

    Maybe, teams have now realized that 10 yr deals rarely work out great from an investment perspective on their part. Yet some players are still looking for a 10 yr guaranteed security deal when perhaps that time has 'passed'?

    I am certain that Harper and Machado are aware of what Cano, Stanton etc have gotten out of owners over the past years...but every year isn't like the rest. If they were FA 2-5 yrs ago, I am sure that they probably would have got the contract they now want now. But now there is history or a track record of the success/failure of these long-term deals and the owners seem hesitant to offer them (and I can't blame them).

    Every contract has risk associated with it, and in the past that risk was largely assumed by the owners (lack of team opt-outs for non-performance, injury/illness, change in CBA parameters etc). I believe those times have changed.

    This is where players agents, and players themselves, need to be creative. IMO, they are going to have to assume more of the risk to some degree in any contract going forward. Higher upfront salaries say in the beginning yrs of a long-term contract, then including both player and team opt outs would be the way to start.
    It is more than teams just being smarter, it is players feeling like they're being lowballed and they are absolutely correct with revenues at all time highs and so many free agents just sitting out there.

  6. #27231

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Not feeling confident we will get a super star this year Rumors the sox offered 250/8 means the yanks probably not even close to that.

  7. #27232
    Forum Regular
    Greenwave81's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Jefferson City, Missouri

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by J-Rhod0406 View Post
    It is more than teams just being smarter, it is players feeling like they're being lowballed and they are absolutely correct with revenues at all time highs and so many free agents just sitting out there.
    Just because revenues are higher, doesn't mean owners/businessmen need to feel compelled to make bad business decisions...which is what a lot of those 10 yr deals amounted to.

    Players can 'feel' whatever they want...I can guarantee you even the NYY would give Harper or Machado a 3 yr/$100 million deal tomorrow (higher AAV than a 10yr/$300 mill deal) or even a 10 yr/$300 million deal with $100 million payable in the first three years if it had team opt outs along with player opt outs.

    If a bunch of FA are willing to 'sit out' because contracts they WANT are not available, while contracts that are based on present day thinking/reasoning (based on past performance experience) could potentially exist with some concessions on their part, that's on them.

    Even considering present the availability of these supposed 'generational talents' who are age 26...no teams seem willing to give a guaranteed 10 yr deal. Some players/fans say it's 'collusion'...has to be...look at revenues!

    Maybe the owners have just realized based on past experiences that 10 yr deals are often bad for team finances and flexibility under the salary cap for a long period of time and aren't worth it.

  8. #27233

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Didi Gregorius takes key step forward in Tommy John rehab.

    TAMPA — They were hardly the strong throws Didi Gregorius is accustomed to making, but the shortstop — rehabbing from offseason Tommy John surgery — made some light tosses across the diamond on Monday at the team’s minor league facility.

    The beginning of a throwing program was another step in Gregorius’ comeback from the injury he suffered during Game 2 of the ALDS against the Red Sox.

    “Light throwing started [Monday],’’ said Gregorius, who added he made 25 throws from 60 feet.

    He reiterated there is no timetable for his return.
    https://nypost.com/2019/02/11/didi-g...my-john-rehab/

  9. #27234

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Greenwave81 View Post
    Just because revenues are higher, doesn't mean owners/businessmen need to feel compelled to make bad business decisions...which is what a lot of those 10 yr deals amounted to.

    Players can 'feel' whatever they want...I can guarantee you even the NYY would give Harper or Machado a 3 yr/$100 million deal tomorrow (higher AAV than a 10yr/$300 mill deal) or even a 10 yr/$300 million deal with $100 million payable in the first three years if it had team opt outs along with player opt outs.

    If a bunch of FA are willing to 'sit out' because contracts they WANT are not available, while contracts that are based on present day thinking/reasoning (based on past performance experience) could potentially exist with some concessions on their part, that's on them.

    Even considering present the availability of these supposed 'generational talents' who are age 26...no teams seem willing to give a guaranteed 10 yr deal. Some players/fans say it's 'collusion'...has to be...look at revenues!

    Maybe the owners have just realized based on past experiences that 10 yr deals are often bad for team finances and flexibility under the salary cap for a long period of time and aren't worth it.
    MLB is unionized. Sticking it to the players and giving them a decreasing share of the revenue is how we are going to get a work stoppage.

  10. #27235

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by J-Rhod0406 View Post
    MLB is unionized. Sticking it to the players and giving them a decreasing share of the revenue is how we are going to get a work stoppage.
    So teams should just throw whatever money the players want? History shows that 10 year deals are often bad for the team.

    It's less a matter of sticking to them, and moreso that it's often times a bad business decision.

  11. #27236

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NYYfan4life90 View Post
    So teams should just throw whatever money the players want? History shows that 10 year deals are often bad for the team.

    It's less a matter of sticking to them, and moreso that it's often times a bad business decision.
    We aren't even talking 10 year deals at this point, we are more in the neighborhood of 5 years being too much for players like Harper.

    The percentage of revenues going to players has decreased the last 4 years and it will surely go down even further after this off season. I remember the 94 strike and what happened to baseball following it, I don't want to see that again and we are definitely teetering on the brink of another one.

  12. #27237
    NYYF Triple Crown


    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by longtimeyankeefan View Post
    One thing that has long bothered me about this revenue argument is that the same posters who are quoting the $619M in 2017 revenues seem to accept that number as gospel by Forbes Magazine, but almost without exception reject the same source reporting that the Yankees made $14M on that same $619M in revenue.

    No one really knows the Yankees' revenues or expenses, but it would seem logical that Forbes would put as much effort in reporting reliable operating income numbers as they do the operating revenue numbers.


    I don't pretend to know the answers, but I do not believe that the Yankees are taking as significant a profit as some people seem to believe they are. But that is just my opinion.
    Organization’s books are famously closed and kept secret to those outside the organization. There's also disparity on how clubs attribute their local cable networks’ revenue. Orioles keep MASN revenue off the club books as do the Yankees for YES. They view them as unrelated income streams for which players don't participate. Forbes themselves say that the numbers that they used in their article are obtained from interviews with team executives and team documents “to the extent that we can get our hands on them.”

    Every team can (and does) mess with their numbers easily to show (or hide) how profitable they are. Just look at what Jeff Loria did to avoid paying money to Dade County because their agreement was based entirely on profits. Also look at how low the numbers are for the “revenue” of the Jays. They’re making much more revenue than listed because Rogers owns the team and they don’t have to pay for the television rights for the Jays. (Remember that other networks have to pay hundreds of millions of dollars to a team for the right to broadcast games because they make billions in profits).

  13. #27238
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Quote Originally Posted by trapper700 View Post
    Organization’s books are famously closed and kept secret to those outside the organization. There's also disparity on how clubs attribute their local cable networks’ revenue. Orioles keep MASN revenue off the club books as do the Yankees for YES. They view them as unrelated income streams for which players don't participate. Forbes themselves say that the numbers that they used in their article are obtained from interviews with team executives and team documents “to the extent that we can get our hands on them.”

    Every team can (and does) mess with their numbers easily to show (or hide) how profitable they are. Just look at what Jeff Loria did to avoid paying money to Dade County because their agreement was based entirely on profits. Also look at how low the numbers are for the “revenue” of the Jays. They’re making much more revenue than listed because Rogers owns the team and they don’t have to pay for the television rights for the Jays. (Remember that other networks have to pay hundreds of millions of dollars to a team for the right to broadcast games because they make billions in profits).
    And Yankees own their concessions, but in separate books.

  14. #27239

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by J-Rhod0406 View Post
    We aren't even talking 10 year deals at this point, we are more in the neighborhood of 5 years being too much for players like Harper.

    The percentage of revenues going to players has decreased the last 4 years and it will surely go down even further after this off season. I remember the 94 strike and what happened to baseball following it, I don't want to see that again and we are definitely teetering on the brink of another one.
    Ironically, the 94 strike, in part, led to all the rampant PED use. Which led to contracts that went into the players’ 40s. Now they’ve cleaned up some of the PEDs so players can’t play that long and teams are worried about the long term deals.

  15. #27240
    NYYF Legend

    ClownPickle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    San Diego

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Obnoxio View Post
    Ironically, the 94 strike, in part, led to all the rampant PED use. Which led to contracts that went into the players’ 40s. Now they’ve cleaned up some of the PEDs so players can’t play that long and teams are worried about the long term deals.
    This is actually a really funny point.
    Calmer than you are

    7/30/2017: The day the Minnesota Twins bought a prospect from the New York Yankees.

  16. #27241
    Slow in, Fast out ThePinStripes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Dallas, Tejas

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    If players are going to demand $30M/yr in their mid to late 30s, there's going to be a strike. Teams aren't going to effectively waste $90M on a $300M contract.
    A fool and his money can throw one heck of a party!

  17. #27242

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    I'm almost always pro-labor, but these players really sicken me. 99.5% of the country is at-will employees yet they want 10 year guaranteed contracts with the unilateral right to terminate said contract. And they expect to be paid premium salary for mediocre performance in the final few years of their contracts bc they've "earned that right".

    If another season is lost due to strike, I pray for catastrophic attendance and TV declines for 5 straight years that puts the sport on the brink of extinction.

  18. #27243
    NYYF MVP

    Norge's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Southern Ocean County, NJ

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by poneil2321 View Post
    I'm almost always pro-labor, but these players really sicken me. 99.5% of the country is at-will employees yet they want 10 year guaranteed contracts with the unilateral right to terminate said contract. And they expect to be paid premium salary for mediocre performance in the final few years of their contracts bc they've "earned that right".

    If another season is lost due to strike, I pray for catastrophic attendance and TV declines for 5 straight years that puts the sport on the brink of extinction.
    I have to disagree. It is silly to compare baseball players to the 99.5% of the population that consists of at-will employees. These baseball players have extremely rare skills that are available only for a finite time. Moreover, they’ve worked really hard to get where they wre today. If any of us were in their shoes, I’d bet we would look for the same long term security that was seemingly available to free agents just a few years ago. If MLB is indeed raking in billions, the players should be paid accordingly. The MLBPA should not bend over. They earned their fair share of those billions.

    And why would you honestly hope for the sport to suffer? To the brink of extinction?

  19. #27244
    The Best Ever ! jnewmark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Stax 1966

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by BabyBombers View Post
    Yes we do. He almost won ROY last year as a 22 year old. Miggy doubles is here to stay.
    Maybe. If he continues to be the worst 3rd baseman in the league, I think the NYY have a decision to make going forward.
    More people have walked on the moon than have scored an earned run off of Mariano Rivera in the postseason.

  20. #27245
    Administrator Bub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    The Boonies

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken711 View Post
    Didi Gregorius takes key step forward in Tommy John rehab.



    https://nypost.com/2019/02/11/didi-g...my-john-rehab/
    Wasn't expecting any throwing this early in his rehab, no matter how light. Maybe he'll return earlier than we thought.
    Let the kids play.

  21. #27246

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Bub View Post
    Wasn't expecting any throwing this early in his rehab, no matter how light. Maybe he'll return earlier than we thought.
    I was hoping that Didi can strictly DH while he recovers from TJ surgery the same path that Ohtani was doing but looks like that is not happen.

    Yanks need some LH bats in this lineup.

  22. #27247
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Quote Originally Posted by poneil2321 View Post
    I'm almost always pro-labor, but these players really sicken me. 99.5% of the country is at-will employees yet they want 10 year guaranteed contracts with the unilateral right to terminate said contract. And they expect to be paid premium salary for mediocre performance in the final few years of their contracts bc they've "earned that right".

    If another season is lost due to strike, I pray for catastrophic attendance and TV declines for 5 straight years that puts the sport on the brink of extinction.
    Youd rather have the money go to the billionaire owners who exploit the rare talents of these young men for their own profit?

  23. #27248

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by poneil2321 View Post
    I'm almost always pro-labor, but these players really sicken me. 99.5% of the country is at-will employees yet they want 10 year guaranteed contracts with the unilateral right to terminate said contract. And they expect to be paid premium salary for mediocre performance in the final few years of their contracts bc they've "earned that right".

    If another season is lost due to strike, I pray for catastrophic attendance and TV declines for 5 straight years that puts the sport on the brink of extinction.
    They have a rare, *unreplaceable* skill set and are putting their bodies on the line daily, including the risk of long-term and sometimes permanent pain. They expect compensation for all that. And what they do, unlike what Hal does, truly is unreplaceable. Out of the 7.5 billion people in the world, maybe 2 or 3 can give you a similar WAR from third base as Machado.
    You'd rather many owners make tens or even hundreds of millions for just sitting around and in many cases actually doing a *bad* job? At least these top players work hard and do their job at an elite level.

  24. #27249

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    Youd rather have the money go to the billionaire owners who exploit the rare talents of these young men for their own profit?
    The envy that some fans feel towards the players has always puzzle me as they rather side with billionaires, many of whom born with a silver spoon than ballplayers that mostly came from modest or poverty environments. So much for cheering for the underdog that made it big-time because they were blessed with certain athletic skills.

  25. #27250

    Re: Official 2018-19 Offseason / Hot Stove Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ag3 View Post
    Vegas knows. Something is up.

    Vegas is the real Bobcat, eh?


    No; what Vegas always knows is the level of betting on various alternatives. In order to ensure a return regardless of the outcome of any event on which they are taking bets, betting brokers have to set the odds in a manner that encourages betting at a level they think reflects true probabilities. Thus, if a lot of foolish betters are betting on the Yankees based on their historic track record in free agency, Vegas has to adjust the odds to discourage that betting and encourage betting on other teams.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 7 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 7 guests)

     

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts