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  1. #51
    time of my life ... ajra21's Avatar
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by fredgmuggs View Post
    Call me skeptical, but I really doubt Trump actually prays.

    (does the guy ever button his coat? He looks like a slob)
    He prays to himself, often out loud.

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    JFC, the man is amazing.
    He certainly is ... something.
    Bring tea for the Tillerman; Steak for the son; Wine for the woman
    who made the rain come; Seagulls sing your hearts away;
    'Cause while the sinners sin, the children play ...

  2. #52

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by trapper700 View Post
    RIP McCain; even though he has, for decades, actively made not only America, but the world a worse place and was overall a terrible human being. We all die, respecting the dead doesn’t mean we have to place them on a pedestal and lionize them.

    Stay classy.

    If we're going to stoop to this level, perhaps you missed it, but in case you didn’t, no argument from you that someone called Ted Kennedy a hero in this thread? Tell that to the Kopechne family. Or tell that to the family of the woman raped and abused at his compound while he once again partied with his nephews. Or tell this to the victims of this cowardly murderous drunkard's other abuses. But, he made the world a better place and was an outstanding human being, huh?

  3. #53
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    I said it in the other thread when he stopped treatment.

    I didnít often agree with Senator McCain politically but unlike many conservative politicians I always got the feeling he was trying to do the best for the country as he saw it and not just what was best for him and his corporate cronies.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  4. #54

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Tripper View Post
    I said it in the other thread when he stopped treatment.

    I didn’t often agree with Senator McCain politically but unlike many conservative politicians I always got the feeling he was trying to do the best for the country as he saw it and not just what was best for him and his corporate cronies.
    Agreed, although I’d expand that to all politicians not just conservatives.

  5. #55
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    I can’t be as rough on McCain as some others. Even just in his political career, his occasional moments of genuine integrity, working across the aisle, expressing the principles of Congress as a patriotic, democratic institution put him well ahead of all but a few of his peers, even if his actions often fell short of his espoused principles.

    There are precious few politicians - hell, precious few people - whose lives and reputations can stand up against a catalog of their worst sins.
    Last edited by JL25and3; 08-26-18 at 05:45 PM.

  6. #56

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    I canít be as rough on McCain as some others. Even just in his political career, his occasional moments of genuine integrity, working across the aisle, expressing the principles of Congress as a patriotic, democratic institution put him well ahead of all but a few of his peers, even if his actions often fell short of his espoused principles.

    There are precious few politicians - heíll, precious few people - whose lives and reputations can stand up against a catalog of their worst sins.
    That's a great post and I agree 100%.
    His mother, Roberta McCain is still living. She's 106 years old.
    The presidency doesn't change who you are. It reveals who you are. First Lady Michelle Obama (2015)

  7. #57
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    I canít be as rough on McCain as some others. Even just in his political career, his occasional moments of genuine integrity, working across the aisle, expressing the principles of Congress as a patriotic, democratic institution put him well ahead of all but a few of his peers, even if his actions often fell short of his espoused principles.

    There are precious few politicians - heíll, precious few people - whose lives and reputations can stand up against a catalog of their worst sins.
    Well said.
    2018: the year the USA put children in cages

  8. #58

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    His mother exudes grace and elegance and obviously possesses incredible genes. I hope that her heart can withstand the loss of her "child", which still has to be devastating regardless of their ages.

  9. #59
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by ArodEra View Post
    Stay classy.

    If we're going to stoop to this level, perhaps you missed it, but in case you didn’t, no argument from you that someone called Ted Kennedy a hero in this thread? Tell that to the Kopechne family. Or tell that to the family of the woman raped and abused at his compound while he once again partied with his nephews. Or tell this to the victims of this cowardly murderous drunkard's other abuses. But, he made the world a better place and was an outstanding human being, huh?
    I like how, in order to point out a hypocrisy that doesn’t exist, you’re putting words not just into my mouth but another poster’s mouth as well. No one here called Ted Kennedy a hero, and the only mention of him in this very thread was just to say that they both died of the same cancer. Which means that this entire post of yours was utterly pointless and shows how petty of a person you are.

  10. #60

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by trapper700 View Post
    I like how, in order to point out a hypocrisy that doesn’t exist, you’re putting words not just into my mouth but another poster’s mouth as well. No one here called Ted Kennedy a hero, and the only mention of him in this very thread was just to say that they both died of the same cancer. Which means that this entire post of yours was utterly pointless and shows how petty of a person you are.

    9 years to this day Ted Kennedy passed of the same brain cancer.
    Heaven needed another hero.
    No matter how you want to interpret the hero comment, stay classy, which is my point.

  11. #61
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    President Trump nixed issuing a statement that praised the heroism and life of Sen. John McCain, telling senior aides he preferred to issue a tweet before posting one Saturday night that did not include any kind words for the late Arizona Republican...

    White House aides instead posted statements from officials other than the president praising McCain. By Sunday afternoon, the vice president, secretary of state, homeland security secretary, defense secretary, national security adviser, White House press secretary, counselor to the president, education secretary, interior secretary and others had posted statements lauding the former 2008 Republican presidential nominee. Former presidents Barack Obama and George W. Bush issued glowing eulogies as well.

    Other world leaders, including Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and French President Emmanuel Macron, also released similar statements.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/ampht...mpression=true

  12. #62
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Shows what a classless, soulless, heartless loser 45 is
    2018: the year the USA put children in cages

  13. #63
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by ArodEra View Post
    No matter how you want to interpret the hero comment, stay classy, which is my point.
    *shrug* I obviously interpreted that to refer to McCain only as he was widely regarded as a war hero and not to Kennedy because he was never considered as such and wasn’t even deployed in the Korean war. And I certainly don’t think someone should be considered a hero just because they served us in the Senate. But I guess you’ll have to ask BRenninger for clarification.

  14. #64

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by trapper700 View Post
    *shrug* I obviously interpreted that to refer to McCain only as he was widely regarded as a war hero and not to Kennedy because he was never considered as such and wasn’t even deployed in the Korean war. And I certainly don’t think someone should be considered a hero just because they served us in the Senate. But I guess you’ll have to ask BRenninger for clarification.
    Fair enough. In retrospect it really doesn’t matter what he meant and I shouldn’t have expressed what I did in the first place.

  15. #65
    Not fooling anyone. Soriambi's Avatar
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post


    But not the other way around? Like, you just read a laundry list as to why McCain was a person of suspect character and the fact some here question his lionization makes you think conservatives are justified in their hatred of libruls?

    McCain mainstreamed Palin, which ultimately beget us Donald Trump.
    I'm not so sure of this. I think Palin might have been an early symptom of the disease, rather than the cause.
    -Kevin

    "My point is you can't compare things with statistics." Joe Morgan


    "I'd have won that trial. I've often said that." Stephen A. Smith on the OJ Simpson trial

    RIP, Pete.

  16. #66

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by Nome View Post
    I'd love to see your short list on trump. An then I'd have to post my long list on trump except it would be 600 pages long.


    Andy
    Andy, trapper700 is no Trump fan. Just fyi.
    "A Prince whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people."
    -- Declaration of Independence

  17. #67
    Word of the Year is Complicit ojo's Avatar
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by Soriambi View Post
    I'm not so sure of this. I think Palin might have been an early symptom of the disease, rather than the cause.
    I mean, itís a bit more complex than this (though not much), but McCain introduced Palin to the mainstream of the GOP: a brand of populist anti-intellectualism that resonated with the base, and Trump took notes to sprinkle in a xenophobic, America-first into the populism.
    This is not America...No! https://youtu.be/neLXqbR_r0E

  18. #68
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post
    a brand of populist anti-intellectualism that resonated with the base, and Trump took notes to sprinkle in a xenophobic, America-first into the populism.
    As I noted above, this could easily describe Pat Buchanan's primary campaign against GHWB in 1992. His "Culture War" speech pretty much defined the GOP convention that year, and Gingrich rode a lot of that in getting the "angry white males," as they were called then, to the polls in 1994 when the Republicans took over Congress for the first time since just after WWII.

    Palin wasn't some spark out of nowhere, this has been building a long time.

  19. #69
    Not fooling anyone. Soriambi's Avatar
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    I canít be as rough on McCain as some others. Even just in his political career, his occasional moments of genuine integrity, working across the aisle, expressing the principles of Congress as a patriotic, democratic institution put him well ahead of all but a few of his peers, even if his actions often fell short of his espoused principles.

    There are precious few politicians - hell, precious few people - whose lives and reputations can stand up against a catalog of their worst sins.
    Agreed.
    -Kevin

    "My point is you can't compare things with statistics." Joe Morgan


    "I'd have won that trial. I've often said that." Stephen A. Smith on the OJ Simpson trial

    RIP, Pete.

  20. #70

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by HelloNewman View Post
    As I noted above, this could easily describe Pat Buchanan's primary campaign against GHWB in 1992. His "Culture War" speech pretty much defined the GOP convention that year, and Gingrich rode a lot of that in getting the "angry white males," as they were called then, to the polls in 1994 when the Republicans took over Congress for the first time since just after WWII.

    Palin wasn't some spark out of nowhere, this has been building a long time.
    Started with Nixonís ďLaw & OrderĒ campaign in 1968, followed by the exodus of Reagan Democrats in 1968. Both the 1968 and 1980 campaigns were built on blatant appeals to racism.

  21. #71

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    I canít be as rough on McCain as some others. Even just in his political career, his occasional moments of genuine integrity, working across the aisle, expressing the principles of Congress as a patriotic, democratic institution put him well ahead of all but a few of his peers, even if his actions often fell short of his espoused principles.

    There are precious few politicians - hell, precious few people - whose lives and reputations can stand up against a catalog of their worst sins.
    Sadly it used to be common for politicians to work across the aisle. McCain is a throwback to that era. Friendships were formed between Congressmen based on common interests and being good neighbors. They didnít let party affiliation to define who they were as people. It wasnít unusual for the first expression of condolence for a death in the family or the first offer to help in a time of serious family illness to come from a member of the other party. Today they canít even be civil to each other. Sadly.

  22. #72
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    The flag over the White House was at half-staff yesterday, when Trump wasnít there. Today, heís back.

    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  23. #73
    Get Off My Lawn. Maynerd's Avatar
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    I canít be as rough on McCain as some others. Even just in his political career, his occasional moments of genuine integrity, working across the aisle, expressing the principles of Congress as a patriotic, democratic institution put him well ahead of all but a few of his peers, even if his actions often fell short of his espoused principles.

    There are precious few politicians - hell, precious few people - whose lives and reputations can stand up against a catalog of their worst sins.
    Well stated. Thank you.

    There are a few posts in this thread for which the authors should be ashamed. I wouldn't necessarily expect everyone to put McCain on a pedestal, but the man served his country, between the Navy and Congress, for over 50 years. He endured torture and spent six years in unspeakable captivity. If you didn't like his politics, fine, but to besmirch his character upon his passing is abhorrent.

    Several of you should have just avoided comment, rather than to paint a flawed but genuine hero in solely a political light. There's more than one point of view on issues, and if someone has a viewpoint that's different than yours, that doesn't make them evil.

    Don't bother responding to this particular post. I've had my say, and I'm done with the issue. I just needed to say that I'm deeply disappointed in several comments, and out-and-out disgusted by a few of them.

    "But what people tend to forget...is that being a Yankee is as much about character as it is about performance; as much about who you are as what you do."
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  24. #74
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    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    The flag over the White House was at half-staff yesterday, when Trump wasnít there. Today, heís back.

    Which is why he will never be respected as a person. Shows how pathetic and spiteful he is.
    2018: the year the USA put children in cages

  25. #75

    Re: Arizona senator John McCain has died

    Quote Originally Posted by Maynerd View Post
    Well stated. Thank you.

    There are a few posts in this thread for which the authors should be ashamed. I wouldn't necessarily expect everyone to put McCain on a pedestal, but the man served his country, between the Navy and Congress, for over 50 years. He endured torture and spent six years in unspeakable captivity. If you didn't like his politics, fine, but to besmirch his character upon his passing is abhorrent.

    Several of you should have just avoided comment, rather than to paint a flawed but genuine hero in solely a political light. There's more than one point of view on issues, and if someone has a viewpoint that's different than yours, that doesn't make them evil.

    Don't bother responding to this particular post. I've had my say, and I'm done with the issue. I just needed to say that I'm deeply disappointed in several comments, and out-and-out disgusted by a few of them.
    Nicely put.

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