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  1. #201
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by fredgmuggs View Post
    I actually attended a Barry Manilow concert. I bet you never thought you would hear anybody admit to that outloud.
    Is that why you hide your face behind a fence?
    Forgive me for taking the Contrarian view

  2. #202
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by fredgmuggs View Post
    I actually attended a Barry Manilow concert. I bet you never thought you would hear anybody admit to that outloud.
    My guess is front row seats were 2 for 1? I actually think the man was/is very talented - but he sold out to commercialism very early on in his budding career.
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  3. #203

    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    My guess is front row seats were 2 for 1? I actually think the man was/is very talented - but he sold out to commercialism very early on in his budding career.
    This was late 70's when he was at the height of his At the Copa fame. My friend was supposed to take his little sister and her two friends (they were around 14/15 years old) but he managed to conveniently get sick. So I played hero and chaperoned them. It was one of the oddest crowds I ever saw at a concert which is my most enjoyable memory from the concert.

    So anyway, I have "seeing Barry Manilow in concert" checked off my bucket list (as if he was ever on my bucket list)
    Success is getting what you want. Happiness is wanting what you get. ~ Dale Carnegie

  4. #204
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    I don't know if I've ever ever seen Barry Manilow quoted.

    Let this be the magic at last.
    Quite the philosopher. That’s from his famous essay, "Self-Reliance."

  5. #205
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fredgmuggs View Post
    This was late 70's when he was at the height of his At the Copa fame. My friend was supposed to take his little sister and her two friends (they were around 14/15 years old) but he managed to conveniently get sick. So I played hero and chaperoned them. It was one of the oddest crowds I ever saw at a concert which is my most enjoyable memory from the concert.

    So anyway, I have "seeing Barry Manilow in concert" checked off my bucket list (as if he was ever on my bucket list)
    I was hoping you’d say you saw him accompanying Bette Midler at the Continental Baths. I wasn’t expecting it, though.

  6. #206

    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bucky View Post
    MY fear. If he retires That is going to hurt. Last year, pitching was my top priority - we got Stanton and Monty got hurt (sucked). This year I wanted even more pitching (Happ replacing CC as our LHP). We targeted Manny from Day one. If we lose CC we don't have a 5th starter - we just gave up Sheff (LHP) I liked Tate too - Loaisiga, I don't like Cessa, Adams, or German are regular SP (spot yes). I love Abreu but he is not ready... I would convert Green to SP but that's not happening because we depend on him in the pen. I am honestly having doubts is Brian putting together a championship team because Manny never was a need. Stanton was never a need last year.
    There are reports that Cashman is seriously looking into Kikuchi with a January 2 posting deadline, we’ll find out during the coming week.

  7. #207
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Marsh View Post
    There are reports that Cashman is seriously looking into Kikuchi with a January 2 posting deadline, we’ll find out during the coming week.
    I would love this. Like insurance. I still worry about the Japanese pitchers because of Igawa but his numbers are impressive and pitch type (FB, Slider, Curve, with a Splitter that is unknown name). I will be disappointed if we DON'T get him now with me being worried about our pitching. If we get outbid by Padres I will not be happy. Just think of this (Brian love this). Padres get Kikuchi, makes a 3 team trade to get Andújar and we get Kluber. Padres end up with Kikuchi, Tatis, and Andújar and we end up with Manny and Kluber. Everybody here will think Brian is a genius but Padres made a GREAT DEAL.

    PS I want Gerrit Cole next off season.

    Thanks it's a nice thought

  8. #208
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Marsh View Post
    There are reports that Cashman is seriously looking into Kikuchi with a January 2 posting deadline, we’ll find out during the coming week.
    MLB trade rumors predicts a 6yr/$42M contract for Kikuchi, with an $8M release fee. IMO that's too long for an unknown.

    I think a 3yr/$25M Kikuchi contract (with approx. a $6M release fee) gives the Yanks a very good opportunity to experiment with a semi-regular 6-man rotation as well as creating the inevitable depth they'll need throughout the season.

    I don't care if it means the 5 best starters will get less starts-they'll be fresher and healthier down the stretch and in the post season because of a lightened workload.
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  9. #209
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    MLB trade rumors predicts a 6yr/$42M contract for Kikuchi, with an $8M release fee. IMO that's too long for an unknown.

    I think a 3yr/$25M Kikuchi contract (with approx. a $6M release fee) gives the Yanks a very good opportunity to experiment with a semi-regular 6-man rotation as well as creating the inevitable depth they'll need throughout the season.

    I don't care if it means the 5 best starters will get less starts-they'll be fresher and healthier down the stretch and in the post season because of a lightened workload.
    Still would do it. Agree I don't like the 6 yrs but it's 7M/yr for a possible SP that's LHP. We stuck out all off season and this is a good move so we know it's not going to happen (be happy we don't bet). "Brian know more and is smarter than us". It is a very nice thought by Bill and we will see because the deadline is next week.

  10. #210
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    MLB trade rumors predicts a 6yr/$42M contract for Kikuchi, with an $8M release fee. IMO that's too long for an unknown.

    I think a 3yr/$25M Kikuchi contract (with approx. a $6M release fee) gives the Yanks a very good opportunity to experiment with a semi-regular 6-man rotation as well as creating the inevitable depth they'll need throughout the season.

    I don't care if it means the 5 best starters will get less starts-they'll be fresher and healthier down the stretch and in the post season because of a lightened workload.
    That’s a long time, but a low cost. If he’s not a good starter, put him in the bullpen, send him down, trade him, even release him if necessary. It costs money, but not enough to hamstring the team's finances even a little.

  11. #211
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    MLB trade rumors predicts a 6yr/$42M contract for Kikuchi, with an $8M release fee. IMO that's too long for an unknown.

    I think a 3yr/$25M Kikuchi contract (with approx. a $6M release fee) gives the Yanks a very good opportunity to experiment with a semi-regular 6-man rotation as well as creating the inevitable depth they'll need throughout the season.

    I don't care if it means the 5 best starters will get less starts-they'll be fresher and healthier down the stretch and in the post season because of a lightened workload.
    That strategy would likely also lead to fewer wins, as you are substituting starts from your best starters for starts from your sixth best option. If the division race is tight, that might just put you in the wildcard.

  12. #212
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by YFIB View Post
    That strategy would likely also lead to fewer wins, as you are substituting starts from your best starters for starts from your sixth best option. If the division race is tight, that might just put you in the wildcard.
    With starting pitchers no longer expected to go more than about 6 innings per start, I think it makes more sense to look towards a 4-man rotation.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  13. #213
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    MLB trade rumors predicts a 6yr/$42M contract for Kikuchi, with an $8M release fee. IMO that's too long for an unknown.

    I think a 3yr/$25M Kikuchi contract (with approx. a $6M release fee) gives the Yanks a very good opportunity to experiment with a semi-regular 6-man rotation as well as creating the inevitable depth they'll need throughout the season.

    I don't care if it means the 5 best starters will get less starts-they'll be fresher and healthier down the stretch and in the post season because of a lightened workload.
    I don't think a 6/$42M contract is a hinderance here - I would sign him and have him as the long man/spot starter to begin the season.
    Forgive me for taking the Contrarian view

  14. #214
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    With starting pitchers no longer expected to go more than about 6 innings per start, I think it makes more sense to look towards a 4-man rotation.
    What are you - a radical?
    Forgive me for taking the Contrarian view

  15. #215
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by longtimeyankeefan View Post
    What are you - a radical?
    I'm a big fan of Earl Weaver's Laws.

    7. It’s easier to find four good starters than five.
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  16. #216
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by YFIB View Post
    That strategy would likely also lead to fewer wins, as you are substituting starts from your best starters for starts from your sixth best option. If the division race is tight, that might just put you in the wildcard.
    See if you think this has any validity:

    124 ML pitchers made at least 20 starts in 2018. 92 made at least 25 starts. Only 56 made at least 30 starts - less than half of the 124.

    Out of the 56, 42 of them had less than 200 IP. These guys are averaging less than 18 outs per start. That leaves about 10 or 11 outs for the bullpen to get - too many outs to get, IMO. Why else would teams like the Yanks be favoring 8-man bullpens and paying these relievers more money each season? Effective relievers (who are usually failed starters) are becoming increasingly important.

    I think in order to get these starters to average 6IP per start/18 outs overall, they need more stamina & more rest between starts. Perhaps 6 starters with more stamina (120 pitches per start?) may lead to more effectiveness of the pitching staff overall, vs. 5 guys who tire a bit quicker (100 pitches per start or less) and tax the bullpen? Does this make any sense?

    Japanese starters only pitch once a week. I don't have any numbers to back me up, but there seem to be less TJ surgeries on Japanese starters? If that's true, I wonder why that is?
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  17. #217
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Per Joel Sherman in today's NY Post:

    The Yanks are the only team in MLB who have 5 starters on their roster to pitch at least 150 innings in 2018.

    Luis-32 starts/191.1 IP/3152 pitches thrown/98.5 pitches thrown per start/5.98 IP per start
    Tanaka-27 starts/2398 pitches thrown/88.8 pitches thrown per start/156 IP/5.78 IP per start
    Paxton-28 starts/160.1 IP/2603 pitches thrown/93 pitches thrown per start/5.71 IP per start
    Haap-31 starts/177.2 IP/3051 pitches thrown/98.4 pitches thrown per start/5.73 IP per start
    CC-29 starts/153 IP/2506 pitches thrown/86.4 pitches thrown per start/5.28 IP per start

    162 games/6 starters = 27 starts each @ 6IP per start = 162IP per starter.

    Please share your thoughts re: this information.
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  18. #218
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    Per Joel Sherman in today's NY Post:

    The Yanks are the only team in MLB who have 5 starters on their roster to pitch at least 150 innings in 2018.

    Luis-32 starts/191.1 IP/3152 pitches thrown/98.5 pitches thrown per start/5.98 IP per start
    Tanaka-27 starts/2398 pitches thrown/88.8 pitches thrown per start/156 IP/5.78 IP per start
    Paxton-28 starts/160.1 IP/2603 pitches thrown/93 pitches thrown per start/5.71 IP per start
    Haap-31 starts/177.2 IP/3051 pitches thrown/98.4 pitches thrown per start/5.73 IP per start
    CC-29 starts/153 IP/2506 pitches thrown/86.4 pitches thrown per start/5.28 IP per start

    162 games/6 starters = 27 starts each @ 6IP per start = 162IP per starter.

    Please share your thoughts re: this information.
    They’re all throwing <100 pitches per start. I don’t see any reason to protect them more by giving 27 starts to their sixth-best starter.

  19. #219
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    They’re all throwing <100 pitches per start. I don’t see any reason to protect them more by giving 27 starts to their sixth-best starter.
    27 starts X 100 pitches thrown = 2700 pitches thrown

    Interestingly, the 2 starters that exceeded 2700 pitches thrown (Severino & Happ) seemed to be less effective in October. I'm sure it could be just a coincidence.

    Also, could a more-rested starter throw more effective pitches per start?

    Could the sixth starter make the five ahead of him more effective per start?
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  20. #220
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    27 starts X 100 pitches thrown = 2700 pitches thrown

    Interestingly, the 2 starters that exceeded 2700 pitches thrown (Severino & Happ) seemed to be less effective in October. I'm sure it could be just a coincidence.

    Also, could a more-rested starter throw more effective pitches per start?

    Could the sixth starter make the five ahead of him more effective per start?
    I doubt it. You’re not exerting the pitchers that badly to begin with.

  21. #221
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JL25and3 View Post
    You’re not exerting the pitchers that badly to begin with.
    If that's true then why are starters throwing more pitches per inning, why are they having more arm/elbow problems, why are they losing velocity and movement as they tire, & why do they generally become less effective in the post season?

    IMO relievers are affected in the same ways, because they are used more regularly than ever before.
    "Somebody once asked me if I ever went up to the plate trying to hit a home run. I said, 'Sure, every time.'" -- Mickey Mantle

  22. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjb23 View Post
    If that's true then why are starters throwing more pitches per inning, why are they having more arm/elbow problems, why are they losing velocity and movement as they tire, & why do they generally become less effective in the post season?

    IMO relievers are affected in the same ways, because they are used more regularly than ever before.
    I don’t think pitchers have more injuries than before. They’re treated more often for injuries, because those same injuries don’t end careers anymore.

    Every pitcher in history has lost velocity and movement as he got tired. Now they’re taken out earlier for strong relievers rather than being expected to pitch through it - which is where the strain comes in.

  23. #223
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    Re: 2018 CC Sabathia Performance Thread

    https://nypost.com/2019/01/08/cc-sab...medium=twitter

    CC Sabathia’s positive step gives Yankees Sonny Gray leverage
    By Dan Martin January 8, 2019 | 6:05p

    CC Sabathia took a step closer to being back in the Yankees’ rotation to start the season — and being healthy.

    The left-hander, who had a heart scare last month that led doctors to insert a stent to open a blocked artery via an angioplasty procedure, has been cleared to begin working out, the team announced Tuesday.

    Sabathia underwent a scheduled follow-up stress test Tuesday and with spring training five weeks away, he can start baseball activities.
    "Deep to left! Yastrzemski will not get it! It's a home run! A three-run homer by Bucky Dent! And the Yankees now lead by a score of 3-2!" - New York Yankees announcer Bill White (October 2, 1978)

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