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  1. #526
    Social Justice Wieners ArodEra's Avatar
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Yanks12009 View Post
    Except for the first 3 years of ace like production?
    Two very good years out of four. All of which is irrelevant to what he is now and how he should get paid.



  2. #527
    Social Justice Wieners ArodEra's Avatar
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sweet_lou_14 View Post
    New contracts should be paid based on past performance?
    Exactly.



  3. #528

    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ArodEra View Post
    Two very good years out of four. All of which is irrelevant to what he is now and how he should get paid.
    what was wrong with his 2015 season? Not as good as his 2014/2016 season, but you don't consider that a good season? And how the heck is his 2014/2016 seasons not considered great/ace-like?


    man people are hard on Tanaka for no reason at all.

  4. #529
    Calls a tool a tool
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ArodEra View Post
    Should never be paid ace/stopper money because he isn't one.
    To be fair, ace money is now about 30 per.

  5. #530
    Social Justice Wieners ArodEra's Avatar
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Yanks12009 View Post
    what was wrong with his 2015 season? Not as good as his 2014/2016 season, but you don't consider that a good season? And how the heck is his 2014/2016 seasons not considered great/ace-like?


    man people are hard on Tanaka for no reason at all.
    2015 was decent at best. Again, it's not about what he was in the past but what he is now: a pitcher who can throw a few gems (mostly in streaks) but one you can't rely on to come up big when you really need him to. In other words not an ace or stopper. Are you going top argue that he is an ace/stopper this year? Do you want to pay for mediocrity in the future with a few exceptional starts thrown in for good measure?



  6. #531
    Social Justice Wieners ArodEra's Avatar
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ChinMusic View Post
    To be fair, ace money is now about 30 per.
    This is true...even a David Price commanded that. Crazy.



  7. #532

    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ArodEra View Post
    2015 was decent at best. Again, it's not about what he was in the past but what he is now: a pitcher who can throw a few gems (mostly in streaks) but one you can't rely on to come up big when you really need him to. In other words not an ace or stopper. Are you going top argue that he is an ace/stopper this year? Do you want to pay for mediocrity in the future with a few exceptional starts thrown in for good measure?
    Well initially I read your post as a criticism of his current contract, not the future contract. I agree it would be hard to give him big money after this year, but it's been such a tale of two seasons for Tanaka it's hard to know which one is the real Tanaka.

  8. #533
    Social Justice Wieners ArodEra's Avatar
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Yanks12009 View Post
    Well initially I read your post as a criticism of his current contract, not the future contract. I agree it would be hard to give him big money after this year, but it's been such a tale of two seasons for Tanaka it's hard to know which one is the real Tanaka.
    My mistake then. Apologies; I wasn't clear. And agree about the tale of two seasons. Not sure it's worth the risk to pay top money *hoping* to get the good Tanaka game in and game out.



  9. #534

    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ArodEra View Post
    My mistake then. Apologies; I wasn't clear. And agree about the tale of two seasons. Not sure it's worth the risk to pay top money *hoping* to get the good Tanaka game in and game out.
    The thing that scares me is that we are looking at a rotation next year with only Sevy/Gray/Monty lined up to be the starters. In my ideal world, Tanaka doesn't opt out. But if he does, I wouldn't mind going after him as long as the length on the deal isn't 4+ years.

  10. #535

    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    You don't pay based off of past performance, especially when the past performance wasn't even replicated in the current year. Throw in a UCL injury and if he opts out and gets big money elsewhere...let them take that massive risk. If he has to come back begging for a deal less than what he would get if he stayed in the deal...they can talk. But that's unlikey knowing that the FA market is usually thin, someone will take an unnecessary chance.

    Getting Gray made this easier to do.

  11. #536
    Brien "The Incident" just-blaze's Avatar
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ArodEra View Post
    2015 was decent at best. Again, it's not about what he was in the past but what he is now: a pitcher who can throw a few gems (mostly in streaks) but one you can't rely on to come up big when you really need him to. In other words not an ace or stopper. Are you going top argue that he is an ace/stopper this year? Do you want to pay for mediocrity in the future with a few exceptional starts thrown in for good measure?
    2015 was more than decent.

    Him or Darvish is cool with me.

  12. #537
    Brien "The Incident" just-blaze's Avatar
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Yanks12009 View Post
    The thing that scares me is that we are looking at a rotation next year with only Sevy/Gray/Monty lined up to be the starters. In my ideal world, Tanaka doesn't opt out. But if he does, I wouldn't mind going after him as long as the length on the deal isn't 4+ years.
    Even if he doesn't opt out, we should sign a starter. Good teams have 6-7 starters who can keep you in the game.

    We have some strong pitchers in the minors, but Id force them to pitch their way onto the roster.

    If he does opt out, then I would go harder after a tier 1 pitcher (Darvish, Arrietta, Cobb, Tanaka) rather than CC and let the youngins fight over the last spot.

    Either scenario Im fine with.

  13. #538

    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Yanks12009 View Post
    Except for the first 3 years of ace like production?
    When he was pitching - which too often he was not.

  14. #539
    Calls a tool a tool
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by just-blaze View Post
    Even if he doesn't opt out, we should sign a starter. Good teams have 6-7 starters who can keep you in the game.

    We have some strong pitchers in the minors, but Id force them to pitch their way onto the roster.

    If he does opt out, then I would go harder after a tier 1 pitcher (Darvish, Arrietta, Cobb, Tanaka) rather than CC and let the youngins fight over the last spot.

    Either scenario Im fine with.
    We need CC + Tanaka. This team should be the fave for the division title next year. You really dont know what we will get from Montgomery. Sevvie is way better than Monty and look what Sevvie did his 2nd year. You cant book Monty to duplicate this year, let alone improve on it. So I dont think you can have an open audition for the 5th spot as well, who also will have an innings limit to boot. I would rather have a 6 man rotation for 1/2 year. That will give Chance Adams about 16 starts which will be his innings limit anyway. What would happen if you went with Adams as the 5th starter and he flubbed? Kiss the division goodbye or overpay for a midseason trade. I would rather just have CC for money if he finishes this year well.

    So I would go with a 6 man rotation and 3 man bench (catcher not named Romine, Headley/Gleyber and Ellsbury) for the first half, then a 5 man rotation and a 4 man bench for the 2nd half (adding Frazier to the bench). A six man rotation would also help everyone else. Tanaka is better on 6 days. Maybe if Gray had 6 days he could be extended routinely to 110 pitches so that maybe he can pitch into the 7th. Do we really need that 4 man bench? We have good to very good hitters all up and down the lineup. Really need the bench just to cover rest and injuries, and not to get a better matchup.

  15. #540
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    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    I saw some interesting stats pertaining to Tanaka. Overall he's 11-11. In day games he's 2-6 with a 8.19 ERA but in night games he's 9-5 with a 3.66 ERA. And at home he's 7-5 while he's 4-6 on the road. He's winless against the Orioles this year so maybe tonight he can change that.

  16. #541

    Re: 2017 Tanaka Thread

    Good bounceback start. Wasn't dominating but still went 7 strong innings. Hurt by the 2 solo shots but got himself out of some jams when needed.


    Still hope he doesn't opt out.

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