President Donald Trump

[JL25and3]

Where do you draw the line? And, who gets to draw it?

Murder, attempted murder, manslaughter.......sorry, you can't vote anymore.

What about larceny, fraud, arson, kidnapping, child pornography, perjury, blackmail, forgery?

Is the arsonist OK to vote, provided nobody got hurt in the fire? Is the kidnapper OK to vote, provided he returned the kid unharmed?

It would seem a non-violent felon found guilty of treason has still sacrificed his future right to vote, hasn't he?

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you. I'm just saying there's a lot more to it than "unless the crimes were violent..."

The Florida amendment covers everything except murder and sexual felonies. Other violent crimes - well, you've served your time, you're allowed to do most things. Voting is the first thing you should be able to do.

As for drawing the line, it's a question you ask frequently, but usually the answer is pretty simple. In this case, as in many others, the legislature usually draws that line (just as they define those crimes in the first place. Here, the legislature is being bypassed by a referendum, which is another way of deciding.

[Soriambi]

Voting should be an unassailable right for all citizens. Being incarcerated does not take away your citizenship and should not take away your right to vote. Felony disenfranchisement became common after the civil war. It is racist in origin and remains that way due to the systemic racial bias in the criminal justice system. The disenfranchisement rate among African-Americans is three times that of the population as a whole.

Agreed. Also agree with John that line drawing is usually not nearly as difficult as it's made out to be here.

[RYMASTER or Ryan_Yankees]

Unless the crimes were violent, I totally agree.

A few days ago on NPR I heard a story about an Arizona man who was convicted of murder at age 15. He spent 20 years in prison and now wants to vote. I'm not sure what I think about that one. Yes, he was only 15, but he willfully took someone's life.

https://www.azpm.org/p/home-articles...with-felonies/

I think all people should be allowed to vote, even if election day is Tuesday and they're being executed on Wednesday. Not too complicated that way.

[Texsahara]

I think all people should be allowed to vote, even if election day is Tuesday and they're being executed on Wednesday. Not too complicated that way.

Yep. No need to worry about where to draw the line if you just abolish lines.

[Nome]

Yep. No need to worry about where to draw the line if you just abolish lines.

a
I disagree, if you are in Jail you shouldn't have the right to vote. Out of jail you should be able to vote.
Andy

[Texsahara]

a
I disagree, if you are in Jail you shouldn't have the right to vote. Out of jail you should be able to vote.
Andy

Why not?

[Casey at the Bat]

a
I disagree, if you are in Jail you shouldn't have the right to vote. Out of jail you should be able to vote.
Andy

Serious question, why? Even if youkre in jail, the laws being voted on may affect you or your family. Why shouldn’t you be allowed to elect people that represent you, or vote on laws?

And, of course, what if you’re really innocent?

[JL25and3]

Serious question, why? Even if youkre in jail, the laws being voted on may affect you or your family. Why shouldn’t you be allowed to elect people that represent you, or vote on laws?

And, of course, what if you’re really innocent?

Everyone in prison is really innocent. Just ask them.

I’m on the fence about people who are currently incarcerated. They do lose a lot of basic constitutional rights, and the whole idea is that, for one reason or another, they’ve been removed from society. I wouldn’t argue for that too strongly.

However, the more I think about it, the more I beli ve that even murderers and sex felons should be re-enfranchised. They’ve served their time, their debt is paid, and I don’t see any reason they shouldn’t have full citizenship rights.

[Texsahara]

Everyone in prison is really innocent. Just ask them.

I’m on the fence about people who are currently incarcerated. They do lose a lot of basic constitutional rights, and the whole idea is that, for one reason or another, they’ve been removed from society. I wouldn’t argue for that too strongly.

However, the more I think about it, the more I beli ve that even murderers and sex felons should be re-enfranchised. They’ve served their time, their debt is paid, and I don’t see any reason they shouldn’t have full citizenship rights.

I might reconsider if the criminal justice system was not so racist. Probably not but I might.

[RhodyYanksFan]

While everyone was talking about Kanye....

https://thehill.com/policy/energy-en...ronment-office

The Senate voted Thursday to confirm a climate change skeptic and former industry attorney to lead the Department of Justice’s (DOJ) environment division.

Lawmakers voted 52 to 45 to confirm Jeffrey Bossert Clark to be the assistant attorney general for environment and natural resources. Sens. Joe Manchin (D-W.Va.) and Claire McCaskill (D-Mo.), both running for reelection GOP states, joined all Republicans present in voting to confirm Clark.

Clark is and attorney at the law firm Kirkland & Ellis, where he has represented numerous industry clients, including oil giant BP in its efforts to fight certain claims from the 2010 Deepwater Horizon disaster and spill, and the Chamber of Commerce. He’s said climate change science is “contestable.”

Once again, Joe Manchin is the worst (democrat).

[Casey at the Bat]

Everyone in prison is really innocent. Just ask them.

I’m on the fence about people who are currently incarcerated. They do lose a lot of basic constitutional rights, and the whole idea is that, for one reason or another, they’ve been removed from society. I wouldn’t argue for that too strongly.

However, the more I think about it, the more I beli ve that even murderers and sex felons should be re-enfranchised. They’ve served their time, their debt is paid, and I don’t see any reason they shouldn’t have full citizenship rights.

Only in Shawshank.

[Yankee Tripper]

While everyone was talking about Kanye....

https://thehill.com/policy/energy-en...ronment-office

Once again, Joe Manchin is the worst (democrat).

On this one it's way more on the people who voted for Trump.
Seriously Trump's just going to keep nominating anti environment people to the EPA (Environmental Prevention Agency) and the Republicans hold the Senate. It's not like they can be blocked.



Plus Manchin represents Coal Country in WVA.

[jlw1980]

Only in Shawshank.

How can you be so obtuse?

[Casey at the Bat]

How can you be so obtuse?

I’m trying to think of a comeback for this, but I can’t.

[ojo]

I’m trying to think of a comeback for this, but I can’t.

Oh I'm sure you can think of a cute one.

[philleotardo]

I’m trying to think of a comeback for this, but I can’t.

Good. It could end up as time in the hole.

[JL25and3]

At his latest rally in Ohio:

It also gave you a general who was incredible. He drank a little bit too much. You know who I’m talking about right? So Robert E. Lee was a great general. And Abraham Lincoln developed a phobia. He couldn’t beat Robert E. Lee.

He was going crazy. I don’t know if you know this story. But Robert E. Lee was winning battle after battle after battle. And Abraham Lincoln came home, he said, 'I can’t beat Robert E. Lee.' And he had all of his generals, they looked great, they were the top of their class at West Point. They were the greatest people. There’s only one problem — they didn’t know how the hell to win. They didn’t know how to fight. They didn’t know how.

And one day, it was looking really bad. And Lincoln just said, 'You,' hardly knew his name. And they said, 'Don’t take him, he’s got a drinking problem.' And Lincoln said, 'I don’t care what problem he has. You guys aren’t winning.'

And his name was Grant. General Grant. And he went in and he knocked the hell out of everyone. And you know the story. They said to Lincoln, 'You can’t use him anymore, he’s an alcoholic.' And Lincoln said, 'I don’t care if he’s an alcoholic, frankly, give me six or seven more just like him.' He started to win. Grant really did — he had a serious problem, a serious drinking problem, but man was he a good general. And he’s finally being recognized as a great general.

But Lincoln had almost developed a phobia, because he was having a hard time with a true great fighter, a great general Robert E. Lee. But Grant figured it out. And Grant is a great general, and Grant came from right here.

Well, okay, then.

[Bill Marsh]

While everyone was talking about Kanye....

https://thehill.com/policy/energy-en...ronment-office



Once again, Joe Manchin is the worst (democrat).

Nope, he’s just protecting his seat. His vote made no difference. When it matters, he’s a reliably Democratic vote except on coal.

[Bill Marsh]

Everyone in prison is really innocent. Just ask them.

Or ask the Innocence Project.

[Texsahara]

Nope, he’s just protecting his seat. His vote made no difference. When it matters, he’s a reliably Democratic vote except on coal.

That's incorrect although I guess you might define "when it matters" differently than I would.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...e-manchin-iii/

[JL25and3]

Or ask the Innocence Project.

I donate to the Innocence Project. They do great work.

[philleotardo]

Thank you, Lesley Stahl, for doing the job journalists should have been doing all along by pushing back on the parade of lies.

[JL25and3]

Trump: I’m not denying climate change. But it could very well go back. You know, we’re talking about over a millions...

Stahl: But that’s denying it.

Trump: ...of years. They say that we had hurricanes that were far worse than what we just had with Michael.

Stahl: Who says that? "They say?"

Trump: People say. People say that it in the —

Stahl: Yeah, but what about the scientists who say it’s worse than ever?

Trump: You’d have to show me the scientists because they have a very big political agenda, Leslie.

[theDurk]

Everyone in prison is really innocent. Just ask them.

I’m on the fence about people who are currently incarcerated. They do lose a lot of basic constitutional rights, and the whole idea is that, for one reason or another, they’ve been removed from society. I wouldn’t argue for that too strongly.

However, the more I think about it, the more I beli ve that even murderers and sex felons should be re-enfranchised. They’ve served their time, their debt is paid, and I don’t see any reason they shouldn’t have full citizenship rights.

There is also the practical problem of what it would do to local races. Some prisons are in out-of-the-way places where a few thousand inmates could be a voting bloc that would dominate the local precinct/district. The potential for "complications" is real.

Other than that, I also agree with full restitution upon time served, regardless of offence. if they get their passport back and pay taxes, they should vote.

[jlw1980]

I’m trying to think of a comeback for this, but I can’t.

That's because you're a Red Sox fan.