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Thread: Election 2016

  1. #36676
    Tends to be difficult JL25and3's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    I was just reading Dave Barry's recap of last year in the Washington Post, and he cited this story. How did I manage to miss it? I don't see how I could possibly have forgotten about it if I had seen it. Did it just get lost in the avalanche of bizarre goings-on during the primary season?


    Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Tex.) blamed “Donald Trump and his henchmen” for planting a National Enquirer story that accused him of extramarital affairs...

    "[Roger Stone is] a man for whom a term was coined for copulating with a rodent. Well, let me be clear: Donald Trump may be a rat, but I have no desire to copulate with him.”

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.c3992614989a
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.
    - Barry Manilow

  2. #36677

    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    l

    I do think that echo chambers, particularly in this day and age, create pockets where your geographical location, and who you surround yourself with physically, influence your politics, your ideology, etc. So naturally, huge population centers have rather large majorities in that regard, which can completely overwhelm the needs and priorities for citizens that live in less densely populated states.
    Sure. Huge population centers that are diverse in everything from racial composition to industry are *more* likely to produce "echo chambers" than small enclaves in the middle of the country.

    Yeah, that makes sense.

  3. #36678
    time of my life ... ajra21's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Gregorius Chant View Post
    Quite correct. His followers have been trained to listen to only Dear Leader.
    f72ed7a43e35efff027f28619a5f4b72.jpg
    Bring tea for the Tillerman; Steak for the son; Wine for the woman
    who made the rain come; Seagulls sing your hearts away;
    'Cause while the sinners sin, the children play ...

  4. #36679
    time of my life ... ajra21's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by montrealer View Post
    Didn't Dubya promise the Iraq War would not cost America anything due to oil reserve payback?...........7 trillion dollars later..........

    "The Bush administration claimed at its outset that the Iraq war would finance itself out of Iraqi oil revenues. When Bush’s National Economic Council director Lawrence Lindsey told the Wall Street Journal that the war would cost between $100 billion and $200 billion, he came under intense fire from others in the administration who claimed that this was a gross overestimation, and he was forced to resign."

    Well this awkward......
    bush was a joke on many things. laughable to the point that taking him seriously on others wasn’t easy.

    fair play america, you found someone worse. many sad it couldn't be done but you battled through that challenge and proved people wrong.
    Bring tea for the Tillerman; Steak for the son; Wine for the woman
    who made the rain come; Seagulls sing your hearts away;
    'Cause while the sinners sin, the children play ...

  5. #36680
    Not fooling anyone. Soriambi's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    I've spent time trying to understand and self-interpret the argument for and against the electoral college vs popular vote. I'm not quite sure yet where I sit on that.

    The argument for popular vote is pretty apparent. A vote is a vote is a vote.

    And the argument for EC is a little more complex. But I'm not sure I'd agree it's bizarre or deserving of the ridicule and outright dismissal some are throwing at the one person here who has been willing to offer a detailed counter perspective.
    If I wasn't being clear, I don't think the idea of the EC is bizarre or deserving of ridicule or outright dismissal. I think the concept that Iowan voters are in some way analogous to actual minorities is bizarre and deserving of ridicule and outright dismissal. That's why I separated his two thoughts.
    -Kevin

    "My point is you can't compare things with statistics." Joe Morgan


    "I'd have won that trial. I've often said that." Stephen A. Smith on the OJ Simpson trial

    RIP, Pete.

  6. #36681
    time of my life ... ajra21's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Texsahara View Post
    The minimum GPA should be passing. The kid that works his rear off to maintain a 1.85 GPA should not be penalized for not learning as easily as someone else.
    this is the difference between what is called (in the UK) "value added" education and "final score" education.

    i'm going to answer the rest of this in the new education thread.
    Bring tea for the Tillerman; Steak for the son; Wine for the woman
    who made the rain come; Seagulls sing your hearts away;
    'Cause while the sinners sin, the children play ...

  7. #36682

    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Soriambi View Post
    If I wasn't being clear, I don't think the idea of the EC is bizarre or deserving of ridicule or outright dismissal. I think the concept that Iowan voters are in some way analogous to actual minorities is bizarre and deserving of ridicule and outright dismissal. That's why I separated his two thoughts.
    How about simply changing winner take all states into a better system of award. We can start there.

  8. #36683

    Re: Election 2016




  9. #36684
    Not fooling anyone. Soriambi's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Gregorius Chant View Post
    How about simply changing winner take all states into a better system of award. We can start there.
    All good ideas and I'm open to a lot of ideas to change things. I just wanted to be clear as to which comment I was calling bizarre.
    -Kevin

    "My point is you can't compare things with statistics." Joe Morgan


    "I'd have won that trial. I've often said that." Stephen A. Smith on the OJ Simpson trial

    RIP, Pete.

  10. #36685

    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Soriambi View Post
    All good ideas and I'm open to a lot of ideas to change things. I just wanted to be clear as to which comment I was calling bizarre.
    I thought you were pretty clear.

  11. #36686
    NYYF Legend

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    Re: Election 2016

    OMG I agree with Trump on something!

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-price-bidding

    Pharmaceutical and biotech stocks plummeted Wednesday after President-elect Donald Trump said he’d force the industry to bid for government business, a position that aligns him with congressional Democrats and against the powerful drug-manufacturing lobby.
    “They’re getting away with murder,” Trump said at a press conference in New York. “Pharma has a lot of lobbyists and a lot of power and there is very little bidding. We’re the largest buyer of drugs in the world and yet we don’t bid properly and we’re going to save billions of dollars.”
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  12. #36687

    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Tripper View Post
    OMG I agree with Trump on something!

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-price-bidding
    excellent
    Kyle

  13. #36688

    Re: Election 2016

    http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/11/politi...ats/index.html

    Not really seeing all the checks and balances people kept talking about.

  14. #36689

    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Gregorius Chant View Post
    http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/11/politi...ats/index.html

    Not really seeing all the checks and balances people kept talking about.
    House Democrats are fuming after Ret. Gen. James Mattis abruptly canceled his appearance before the House Armed Services Committee slated for Thursday. The move is triggering a backlash from top House Democrats who say without hearing directly from Mattis they will oppose legislation paving the way for his confirmation.
    It's right there.

  15. #36690

    Re: Election 2016

    trump better learn fast.......don't wanna piss off a major news outlet(CNN.)

    CNN: These are Trump's ties to Russia

    These are Trump's ties to Russia
    By Nelli Black and Curt Devine, CNN

    Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump
    Russia has never tried to use leverage over me. I HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH RUSSIA - NO DEALS, NO LOANS, NO NOTHING!
    7:31 AM - 11 Jan 2017


    But he has had dealings in the country. We took a look at a few of them.

    Miss Universe Moscow
    In 2013 Trump made millions when he partnered with Russian billionaire Aras Agalarov to host Miss Universe in Moscow.

    Trump Tower Moscow
    An attempt to build a Trump Tower in Moscow fell through before it began. CNN didn't find any projects that were actually completed in Russia. In a 2007 deposition, Trump was asked about the proposal for the project.



    Trump Vodka
    Trump put down no money, slapped his name on a brand and claimed royalties. Drinks Americas Holdings actually made the vodka. However, the company's former CEO told CNNMoney they didn't make much headway into the Russian market.

    Palm Beach mansion sale
    Trump sold a mansion in Palm Beach, Florida, to Russian billionaire Dmitry Rybolovlev for $95 million.

    "Russians" investing in Trump
    In 2008, Donald Trump Jr. said Trump's businesses "see a lot of money pouring in from Russia... And in terms of high-end product influx into the US, Russians make up a pretty disproportionate cross-section of a lot of our assets; say in Dubai, and certainly with our project in SoHo and anywhere in New York. We see a lot of money pouring in from Russia. There's indeed a lot of money coming for new-builds and resale reflecting a trend in the Russian economy and, of course, the weak dollar versus the ruble," he said.


    more: http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/11/politi...sia/index.html

    related:

    Donald Trump's Many, Many, Many, Many Ties to Russia
    http://time.com/4433880/donald-trump-ties-to-russia/

    Inside Trump’s financial ties to Russia and his unusual flattery of Vladimir Putin
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.e8439b086cf5

    Yes, there is evidence Trump does business with Russians
    http://www.politico.com/blogs/2016-p...ussians-229484

  16. #36691

    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Coffee View Post
    It's right there.
    Next time scroll down:

    House Republican leaders scheduled a vote for Friday on a bill to provide Mattis with a waiver, and even with potentially large numbers of Democratic defections GOP aides say they are confident the measure will pass
    .

    it's expected that the waiver legislation will be approved by both chambers and Mattis will be confirmed as one of the first Cabinet members. Senate leaders are aiming to have his confirmation vote on Inauguration Day, January 20.

  17. #36692

    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Gregorius Chant View Post
    Next time scroll down:

    House Republican leaders scheduled a vote for Friday on a bill to provide Mattis with a waiver, and even with potentially large numbers of Democratic defections GOP aides say they are confident the measure will pass
    it's expected that the waiver legislation will be approved by both chambers and Mattis will be confirmed as one of the first Cabinet members. Senate leaders are aiming to have his confirmation vote on Inauguration Day, January 20.
    Yeah, and..? They vote on it.

    That the GOP believes it will pass despite some dems opposing it doesn't mean there are no checks.

  18. #36693

    Re: Election 2016

    They're already trying to repeal Obamacare with no replacement. Sick, selfish, twisted.

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/p...medium=twitter

  19. #36694
    Pinpoint False1's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Tripper View Post
    Yes more effort should be put into this now.

    It's not working.

    Have you sent a kid to college recently? I can tell you the experience can be overwhelming and the support resources are nearly non-existent.

    We had the means to pay for an expert in the field to assist us with the process, many others are not so fortunate including those who could most use the assistance.
    Yes, I have one in college now and another one two years away. Selfishly, my wallet would love free college for them. Intellectually, I don't think taxpayers should have to pay my kids' burdens especially at these inflated prices.

  20. #36695
    Pinpoint False1's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by Gregorius Chant View Post
    Sure. Huge population centers that are diverse in everything from racial composition to industry are *more* likely to produce "echo chambers" than small enclaves in the middle of the country.

    Yeah, that makes sense.
    I know you think everything boils down to race and gender, but that's not all diversity is about. Diversity of thought and ideology is important as well.

    Got any non-ancedotal evidence to disprove that hypothesis?

    This is written by Nicholas Kristof, a Pulitzer Prize-winning columnist for the NYT for over 15 years that focuses on human rights, women's rights, and other social issues. Its primarily about universities, but I think it applies to social circles and by extension geographies as well. You won't be open to this message, although I think you should be.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/10/o...mpus.html?_r=0

    Quote Originally Posted by Nikolas Kristof
    I share apprehensions about President-elect Trump, but I also fear the reaction was evidence of how insular universities have become. When students inhabit liberal bubbles, they’re not learning much about their own country. To be fully educated, students should encounter not only Plato, but also Republicans.

    We liberals are adept at pointing out the hypocrisies of Trump, but we should also address our own hypocrisy in terrain we govern, such as most universities: Too often, we embrace diversity of all kinds except for ideological. Repeated studies have found that about 10 percent of professors in the social sciences or the humanities are Republicans.

    We champion tolerance, except for conservatives and evangelical Christians. We want to be inclusive of people who don’t look like us — so long as they think like us.

    I fear that liberal outrage at Trump’s presidency will exacerbate the problem of liberal echo chambers, by creating a more hostile environment for conservatives and evangelicals. Already, the lack of ideological diversity on campuses is a disservice to the students and to liberalism itself, with liberalism collapsing on some campuses into self-parody.

  21. #36696
    NYYF Legend

    ojo's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    I know you think everything boils down to race and gender, but that's not all diversity is about. Diversity of thought and ideology is important as well.

    Got any non-ancedotal evidence to disprove that hypothesis?

    This is written by Nicholas Kristof, a Pulitzer Prize-winning columnist for the NYT for over 15 years that focuses on human rights, women's rights, and other social issues. Its primarily about universities, but I think it applies to social circles and by extension geographies as well. You won't be open to this message, although I think you should be.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/10/o...mpus.html?_r=0
    So, in a nutshell, dumb it down for the moron in flyover country who would rather listen to a guy in a gown on Sunday rather than read a book?

  22. #36697
    Pinpoint False1's Avatar
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    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post
    So, in a nutshell, dumb it down for the moron in flyover country who would rather listen to a guy in a gown on Sunday rather than read a book?
    Aside from absolutely nailing on your objectives of mocking people's faith, stereotyping people of a certain region of the country, and injecting that elitist snark you're clearly addicted to...

    ...I have no idea how this relates to what I posted in the slightest.

  23. #36698
    NYYF Legend

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    Re: Election 2016

    Irregardless of whether the media is right or wrong (and I think they largely do the best they can and try to get everything right. They're not perfect, but they're honestly trying their hardest), it is deeply, deeply concerning to me how Trump continues to attempt to delegitimize any media outlet that disagrees with him.

    It's not even about fighting the media outlet -- it's about him trying to claim that every media outlet which disagrees with him is somehow not a legitimate outlet for criticism. And that goes for more than just the media -- he does it with everyone who disagrees. That's really scary, and he needs to stop doing that.


  24. #36699

    Re: Election 2016

    Trump's legal team won Russia Law Firm of the Year award. But he has no dealings with Russia, he swears it! This is not The Onion.

    http://ti.me/2jkE15A

  25. #36700

    Re: Election 2016

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    I know you think everything boils down to race and gender, but that's not all diversity is about.
    No, I really don't. You would have picked up on that if you actually read the words you're quoting:

    Huge population centers that are diverse in everything from racial composition to industry are *more* likely to produce "echo chambers" than small enclaves in the middle of the country.
    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    Diversity of thought and ideology is important as well.
    Correct. Which is why I know huge population centers such as NY or CA, where there is an extraordinary mix of education, ethnicities, gender identities, and industries are more likely to produce open thinking vs small enclaves in sparsely populated parts of the country.


    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    Got any non-ancedotal evidence to disprove that hypothesis?
    Feel free to jump into the pool first. You're the one making the man-bites-dog argument that the center of the country is more diverse in thought and ideology than the coasts.

    Quote Originally Posted by False1 View Post
    This is written by Nicholas Kristof, a Pulitzer Prize-winning columnist for the NYT for over 15 years that focuses on human rights, women's rights, and other social issues. Its primarily about universities, but I think it applies to social circles and by extension geographies as well. You won't be open to this message, although I think you should be.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/10/o...mpus.html?_r=0
    To prove your point about giant population centers you select an article focusing on university campuses, which are very specifically enclaves that are not a good comparison to population centers. And yes, I've read the article, but it's not relevant to this discussion. If you want to talk about ideological echo chambers on college campuses, just say that. I"d agree that any thinking that closes you off to other beliefs is problematic. Which is why I would never vote for someone like Donald Trump, in example.

    It's the coasts that provide openness to social change, and offer a variety of ideologies and thinking - and acceptance. That openness is born out of interacting with a variety of human beings. That they're more likely to vote liberal is a *result* of that openness. You should really stop butchering the application of the phrase "echo chamber." (I'm happy Kristof introduced you to a new phrase, you should probably understand why he uses it and in what context. It doesn't just mean "Libruls need to unnerstand the common white guy better.")

    It wasn't the coasts that elected a racist xenophobe who has contempt for the very country and institutions he's about to lead.

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