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  1. #14101
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Art Vanderlay View Post
    I respect this move by the Red Sox. The organization is in a much different place now then when Dombrowski was hired. For starters the farm in not as strong and they have financial flexibility issues. John Henry concluded Dombrowski is not the person he wants leading the organization for the next 5 years and made a bold move. With 4 WS in 15 years he obviously knows what he’s doing.
    And that is the fundamental difference between the Red Sox and Yankees.

    The Red Sox, under John Henry, are not afraid to disrupt the organization and make dramatic changes in order to get right people in place to address specific organizational needs.

    The Yankees, under Hal Steinbrenner, are mortally afraid to disrupt the organization. It's continuity of bust. While often a good thing, it can also foster an environment of complacency which we've seen the last few years in regards to starting pitching...
    "Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever." - Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

  2. #14102
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    I wonder if the history of dumping people (and often disparaging them on the road out) will someday cause talented people to go in a different direction instead of taking a job with the Red Sox.
    Just win!

  3. #14103
    Hope is eternal
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Dombrowski did as he did in Florida and Detroit. Empty the farm, win, and leave behind a depleted farm team with a major league team of issues. Predicted this when he was hired. No one should be surprised or upset as he got them a ring
    The sky is falling! We are doomed!

  4. #14104
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ChinMusic View Post
    Betts and/or Martinez are on the trade block this winter. Signing Betts after the 2020 season to play LF would be sweet. LeMehiu-Betts-Judge-Sanchez-Torres-Stanton-Voit-Hicks-Urshela is sick.
    Would Frazier and Andujar be enough for Betts?
    "Be a voice, not an echo." - Albert Einstein

  5. #14105

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeePride1967 View Post
    Dombrowski did as he did in Florida and Detroit. Empty the farm, win, and leave behind a depleted farm team with a major league team of issues. Predicted this when he was hired. No one should be surprised or upset as he got them a ring
    Henry approved the deals and signed the checks.
    Success is getting what you want. Happiness is wanting what you get. ~ Dale Carnegie

  6. #14106
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by fredgmuggs View Post
    Henry approved the deals and signed the checks.
    Yup. But I assume on Dombrowski’s word. Henry has no reason to be upset or surprised as he did as he did. It worked but with this method there is a price to be paid and they are now. Word today is either JD Martinez or Betts will be gone after the year to get below the second luxury tax threshold
    The sky is falling! We are doomed!

  7. #14107
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post
    Would Frazier and Andujar be enough for Betts?
    I said after 2020. Why would they have to give Boston anyone?

  8. #14108
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ChinMusic View Post
    I said after 2020. Why would they have to give Boston anyone?
    Yeah - I saw some reference to Betts potentially being on the block this winter. That's insanity.

    And Stanton will keep the Yankees from going after Betts should he be true to his word and test the FA waters after next season.
    "Be a voice, not an echo." - Albert Einstein

  9. #14109
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ChinMusic View Post
    Betts and/or Martinez are on the trade block this winter. Signing Betts after the 2020 season to play LF would be sweet. LeMehiu-Betts-Judge-Sanchez-Torres-Stanton-Voit-Hicks-Urshela is sick.
    I for one am against signing any more Boston outfielder rejects.

  10. #14110
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeePride1967 View Post
    Dombrowski did as he did in Florida and Detroit. Empty the farm, win, and leave behind a depleted farm team with a major league team of issues. Predicted this when he was hired. No one should be surprised or upset as he got them a ring
    Flags fly forever.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  11. #14111
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Yankee Tripper View Post
    Flags fly forever.
    Agreed which is why I said it was a successful hire. But it also ends up with a similar result. I doubt any of the three teams regret the hiring of him. My point is the ownership should not be surprised that he followed the same path (overall successful) he did in the past.
    The sky is falling! We are doomed!

  12. #14112
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Art Vanderlay View Post
    I respect this move by the Red Sox. The organization is in a much different place now then when Dombrowski was hired. For starters the farm in not as strong and they have financial flexibility issues. John Henry concluded Dombrowski is not the person he wants leading the organization for the next 5 years and made a bold move. With 4 WS in 15 years he obviously knows what he’s doing.
    Not at 12:07 am in the morning but he was going to be a lame GM in his final year. I was stunned and didn't see this coming but this may be wrong so I am sorry if I got it wrong. I actually thought of you when I heard this news. He was let go because of bad signings (payroll), not having a closer (dumb), and depleting the farm system (trades). Theo did the same (Crawford?) but actually built up the farm system. I think you were one of the very few that was against the Stanton signing. I am starting to worry about Stanton's contract moving forward (pitching - Cole). This post season is really big for me and I don't know Stanton's role now but it may be a factor. One thing - Brian is never going to be fired and basically runs the team, even the lineups. It was a bold move into another direction (like Tampa).

  13. #14113
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Imagine firing a GM after not meeting expectations? I wonder what that's like.
    Calmer than you are

    7/30/2017: The day the Minnesota Twins bought a prospect from the New York Yankees.

  14. #14114
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bucky View Post
    Not at 12:07 am in the morning but he was going to be a lame GM in his final year. I was stunned and didn't see this coming but this may be wrong so I am sorry if I got it wrong. I actually thought of you when I heard this news. He was let go because of bad signings (payroll), not having a closer (dumb), and depleting the farm system (trades). Theo did the same (Crawford?) but actually built up the farm system. I think you were one of the very few that was against the Stanton signing. I am starting to worry about Stanton's contract moving forward (pitching - Cole). This post season is really big for me and I don't know Stanton's role now but it may be a factor. One thing - Brian is never going to be fired and basically runs the team, even the lineups. It was a bold move into another direction (like Tampa).
    They rode Dombrowski for what he was good for doing. Now, the Red Sox have to figure out a way to keep Betts without trading away too much talent that will be required to replenish their pitching staff. They also need to draft wisely. They do not trust Dombrowski to be the head guy on this project. #NotPenskeMaterial
    "Be a voice, not an echo." - Albert Einstein

  15. #14115
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeePride1967 View Post
    Agreed which is why I said it was a successful hire. But it also ends up with a similar result. I doubt any of the three teams regret the hiring of him. My point is the ownership should not be surprised that he followed the same path (overall successful) he did in the past.
    He kind of follows the scorched earth win at all cost model and move on.
    Baseball is life;
    the rest is just details.

  16. #14116
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ojo View Post
    They rode Dombrowski for what he was good for doing. Now, the Red Sox have to figure out a way to keep Betts without trading away too much talent that will be required to replenish their pitching staff. They also need to draft wisely. They do not trust Dombrowski to be the head guy on this project. #NotPenskeMaterial
    Agree. 3 Div champs, 1 WS in 4 years - can't ask for more. Dave was not going to be extended BUT I feel this was a Joe G mistake. Henry knows less about baseball than Hal so I don't think BoSox has a replacement. Good GMs are more difficult than managers. We did NOT have a replacement for Joe G and I still have doubts. I think Boston FO is going try to tap one of Theo staff and they will say NO and will go inside. Theo replacement did win a WS but was because they had a good team that may happen again (still have a good team). The BoSox fans love Betts as much as we love Judge so there is no way they will trade him and he will probably be a FA and go for the money (fans can accept that). I don't want Betts, JD or anyother Boston player on our roster. I don't think Dave was as surprised as I was.

    thanks

  17. #14117

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Zimmer's Helmet View Post
    And that is the fundamental difference between the Red Sox and Yankees.

    The Red Sox, under John Henry, are not afraid to disrupt the organization and make dramatic changes in order to get right people in place to address specific organizational needs.

    The Yankees, under Hal Steinbrenner, are mortally afraid to disrupt the organization. It's continuity of bust. While often a good thing, it can also foster an environment of complacency which we've seen the last few years in regards to starting pitching...
    I agree. Also, there is a fundamental difference between Henry and Hal. Henry has demonstrated repeatedly that he will do whatever is necessary to win championships, whether it be spending money or making the hard decisions regarding front office personnel. On the other hand Hal has demonstrated repeatedly that his primary objective is maximizing profits. He could have had Verlander two years ago but didn't want to exceed the luxury tax in 2018, this was publicly acknowledged by Cashman. That decision already cost them one championship and may cost them another one this year. Hal is content to be competitive and not win as long as the cash keeps flowing into his coffers. Yankee fans don't want to hear this, Henry is the superior owner. The four championships during the last 15 years validates that.

  18. #14118

    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bucky View Post
    Not at 12:07 am in the morning but he was going to be a lame GM in his final year. I was stunned and didn't see this coming but this may be wrong so I am sorry if I got it wrong. I actually thought of you when I heard this news. He was let go because of bad signings (payroll), not having a closer (dumb), and depleting the farm system (trades). Theo did the same (Crawford?) but actually built up the farm system. I think you were one of the very few that was against the Stanton signing. I am starting to worry about Stanton's contract moving forward (pitching - Cole). This post season is really big for me and I don't know Stanton's role now but it may be a factor. One thing - Brian is never going to be fired and basically runs the team, even the lineups. It was a bold move into another direction (like Tampa).
    Regarding the Staton acquisition it reminds me of this conversation I've had with my wife more than once during shopping trips:

    Wife - we really should buy that it's 50% off!

    Me - I get that it's discounted but do we really need it?

    Wife - Not really but it's 50% off

    Me: I much rather we spend money on something we need.

    Wife - Makes sense but its 50% off

    .

  19. #14119
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bucky View Post
    Agree. 3 Div champs, 1 WS in 4 years - can't ask for more. Dave was not going to be extended BUT I feel this was a Joe G mistake. Henry knows less about baseball than Hal so I don't think BoSox has a replacement. Good GMs are more difficult than managers. We did NOT have a replacement for Joe G and I still have doubts. I think Boston FO is going try to tap one of Theo staff and they will say NO and will go inside. Theo replacement did win a WS but was because they had a good team that may happen again (still have a good team). The BoSox fans love Betts as much as we love Judge so there is no way they will trade him and he will probably be a FA and go for the money (fans can accept that). I don't want Betts, JD or anyother Boston player on our roster. I don't think Dave was as surprised as I was.

    thanks
    I think they got rid of Dombrowski now to set the stage for the best GM-hire possible, and the next 14 months are all about setting the stage to retain Mookie Betts.

    And the hell you wouldn't want him on the Yankees.
    "Be a voice, not an echo." - Albert Einstein

  20. #14120
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Art Vanderlay View Post
    Regarding the Staton acquisition it reminds me of this conversation I've had with my wife more than once during shopping trips:

    Wife - we really should buy that it's 50% off!

    Me - I get that it's discounted but do we really need it?

    Wife - Not really but it's 50% off

    Me: I much rather we spend money on something we need.

    Wife - Makes sense but its 50% off

    .
    Well? Was the purchase made?
    Just win!

  21. #14121
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JDPNYY View Post
    Well? Was the purchase made?
    Of Stanton? You bet.

  22. #14122
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by -tz View Post
    Of Stanton? You bet.
    Where do you keep him?

  23. #14123
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by YFIB View Post
    Where do you keep him?
    Sick bay.

  24. #14124
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    The Fork. It is sticking in them.
    Just win!

  25. #14125
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    Re: The Red Sox Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JDPNYY View Post
    The Fork. It is sticking in them.
    When you come to a fork in the Sox ... leave it.

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