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Mark19
03-21-04, 10:18 PM
Any news about our boy Nick? I remember hearing about his arbitration case early in the month and his earning the 1B job for the Expos before ST. Anyone else know how he's doing?

BTW- IMO, He was just as big an offseason loss as Soriano, despite the great gains we got from both deals. It was very difficult to see him go, I'm sure he'll be a monster player in a few seasons.

NJOBP36
03-21-04, 10:56 PM
12 games .348/.464/.478

FutureYankee
03-22-04, 01:13 AM
owww that is PAInful. i really hope we get his ass back here sometime.. MAN we are gonna miss him. OBP MACHINE that guy...

NJOBP36
03-22-04, 01:18 AM
Anyone know why he's wearing 24 now? At least with the Extra Innings package, I can see Nick and Sori.

BillBuckner
03-22-04, 05:32 AM
Hes gonna be a great player. I wish him the best.

Yanknut023
03-22-04, 08:40 AM
Originally posted by FutureYankee
owww that is PAInful. i really hope we get his ass back here sometime.. MAN we are gonna miss him. OBP MACHINE that guy...

Whenever you feel you miss NJ take a look over at third. That should make you feel a lot better.

Carissa
03-22-04, 08:42 AM
Originally posted by NJOBP36
Anyone know why he's wearing 24 now? At least with the Extra Innings package, I can see Nick and Sori. He used to wear 24 in the minors.

Irabu's Son
03-22-04, 08:54 AM
Originally posted by Yanknut023


Whenever you feel you miss NJ take a look over at third. That should make you feel a lot better.

Yup, I agree.

I do have a Nick Johnson story though. I was in Tampa watching the Tampa Yanks back in 1998, when NJ was really, really young. The stadium was empty except for the maybe 100 of us in there, so we got to sit wherever we wanted. I sat down right next to the Yanks' on-deck circle. It was the 8th inning and at that point, Johnson was 0 for 3 with 3 k's and he made 2 errors in the field. He was on deck, and I shouted, "Hey Nick!" to get his attention. He looked over and I said, "why don't you do something GOOD today??" I thought he was going to kill me. We were about the same age but he was twice my size. He ended up hitting a sac fly.

That said, I wish we could have him back instead of the wonderful tandem of Travis Lee and Tony Clark.

Sixty one
03-22-04, 08:58 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if Johnson is back in NY sometime in the near future...especially if Giambi continues to break down physically!!

NYYFAN
03-22-04, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by Sixty one
I wouldn't be surprised if Johnson is back in NY sometime in the near future...especially if Giambi continues to break down physically!!

Kyles due any minute...:lol:

NJASDJDH
03-22-04, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by Yanknut023


Whenever you feel you miss NJ take a look over at third. That should make you feel a lot better.

Why?

WiffleWOOD
03-22-04, 01:39 PM
from Will Carroll's Under the Knife:

According to Bill Ladson of MLB.com, Nick Johnson is out with a lower back problem. It appears to be muscular at this stage, but with Johnson's history, any injury has to be worrisome. Out since Thursday, Johnson is expected back on Tuesday so watch what he's able to do. Back injuries tend to become chronic, but even in a worst-case, the Expos' medical staff did a phenomenal job getting Vlad Guerrero back last season. I'm sure the Angels appreciate it.

NJOBP36
03-22-04, 02:40 PM
Originally posted by Carissa
He used to wear 24 in the minors.

Right, but did the Yankees hold 24 for Tino or did he just never switch back after Tino left? Unless someone else were 24 the last two years and I can't remember.

Carissa
03-22-04, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by NJOBP36
Right, but did the Yankees hold 24 for Tino or did he just never switch back after Tino left? Unless someone else were 24 the last two years and I can't remember. They held 24 after Tino left. No one wore it until Ruben Sierra came last year.

NJOBP36
03-22-04, 03:57 PM
Originally posted by Carissa
They held 24 after Tino left. No one wore it until Ruben Sierra came last year.

Ok, thanks. I remember that Sierra had 24 after I posted that.

Xhibit
03-22-04, 08:43 PM
NJ's talent was not in question, only his health. If he's healthy, the guy's gonna be a stud 1B, probably the best young 1B in the game today. But, he could also be the next J.D. Drew, and never play a full season. Just remember that to get Javier Vazquez, we had to give up something. If we tried to offer garbage, Vazquez would be a Philly or Brave today. And before you say we could've had him as a FA, he would've probably been signed to an extension with those teams also. This was the only way we could get him, and he is worth NJ, healthy or not.

flymick24
03-23-04, 04:57 AM
but is javy worth johnson PLUS juan rivera and choate?

i would have to say yes, but some would disagree... johnson will be a great 1B in a few years (health willing) and juan rivera has great potential to become a power-hitting RF (he's got a good arm too.)

choate was never really good for us, so i don't lament his loss, but i think we really gave up 2 great talents for javy. that's why i REALLY hope that javy pans out well for us, because if he starts stinking up the joint even after his amazing ST, i'm gonna cry....

SubwayFanatic
03-23-04, 07:04 AM
Go ahead and rip me for this, but I really still think Nick Johnson has a lot to prove.

All this talk about stardom is nice -- and he maybe he reach it -- but until then, I see him as nothing more than an Erubiel Durazo-type player. An often injured player with a good batting eye.

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 07:55 AM
Originally posted by SubwayFanatic
Go ahead and rip me for this, but I really still think Nick Johnson has a lot to prove.

All this talk about stardom is nice -- and he maybe he reach it -- but until then, I see him as nothing more than an Erubiel Durazo-type player. An often injured player with a good batting eye.

http://www.aarongleeman.com/2003_11_30_baseballblog_archive.html#107060555820162115

bakntime
03-23-04, 08:15 AM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


http://www.aarongleeman.com/2003_11_30_baseballblog_archive.html#107060555820162115

He's really stretching by saying that Nick will be a top 5-10 hitter. He doesn't strike me as capable of both average+power AND OBP. I think he's going to have to sacrifice his OBP to increase his SLUG, thereby, IMO, making him never more than a 900 OPS guy. A good hitter? Yes. Top 10? No.

He has yet to have a defining season, and whether injuries prevented him from doing that, or simply the fact that he's not a top 10 hitter remains to be seen, but I just don't think his ceiling is nearly the same as the Pujols, A-Rods, Delgados, Thomes, Heltons, etc, who hit for power and get on base.

SubwayFanatic
03-23-04, 08:31 AM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


http://www.aarongleeman.com/2003_11_30_baseballblog_archive.html#107060555820162115

Gleeman's figures are wrong.

He says, "At 24 years old, Johnson had a .422 on-base percentage in 406 plate appearances. Here is the complete list of players since 1990 who have posted an on-base percentage of at least .420 in a season with 400+ plate appearances by the age of 24:"

Johnson, according to all the sites I vistied, had only 324 at-bats last year.

He had only 378 at-bats the year before.

SubwayFanatic
03-23-04, 08:36 AM
Originally posted by bakntime
He has yet to have a defining season, and whether injuries prevented him from doing that, or simply the fact that he's not a top 10 hitter remains to be seen, but I just don't think his ceiling is nearly the same as the Pujols, A-Rods, Delgados, Thomes, Heltons, etc, who hit for power and get on base.

Good post. You could also throw in the likes of Bonds and Ramirez to your list.

Again, I think Johnson will be far more comparable to Erubiel Durazo than Albert Pujols.

While Johnson may indeed have potential, let's stop acting like he has shown so much during his short major league career.

He has still yet to:

-Stay healthy
-Have 400 at-bats in a season
-Hit .300
-Slug .500
-Hit more than 15 HRs

etc, etc.

The jury is still out on him.

bakntime
03-23-04, 08:48 AM
Originally posted by SubwayFanatic


Gleeman's figures are wrong.

He says, "At 24 years old, Johnson had a .422 on-base percentage in 406 plate appearances. Here is the complete list of players since 1990 who have posted an on-base percentage of at least .420 in a season with 400+ plate appearances by the age of 24:"

Johnson, according to all the sites I vistied, had only 324 at-bats last year.

He had only 378 at-bats the year before.

At bats vs. plate appearances. At bats don't include BB, HBP and sacrifices.

SubwayFanatic
03-23-04, 08:52 AM
Originally posted by bakntime


At bats vs. plate appearances. At bats don't include BB, HBP and sacrifices.

Oops... I knew that.

Irabu's Son
03-23-04, 08:53 AM
Originally posted by bakntime


At bats vs. plate appearances. At bats don't include BB, HBP and sacrifices.

Sacrifices don't count as plate appearances when figuring out someone OBP, do they?

bakntime
03-23-04, 08:57 AM
Originally posted by Irabu's Son


Sacrifices don't count as plate appearances when figuring out someone OBP, do they?

Everything counts as plate appearances... errors, sacrifices, etc. Not sure, however, if sacrifices count against your OBP, but I think they do... it's about the only way you can have an OBP lower than your BA, isn't it?

Irabu's Son
03-23-04, 09:01 AM
Originally posted by bakntime


Everything counts as plate appearances... errors, sacrifices, etc. Not sure, however, if sacrifices count against your OBP, but I think they do... it's about the only way you can have an OBP lower than your BA, isn't it?

I'm pretty sure errors and sacs don't count either way (not even as plate appearances) when figuring your OBP. I think it's just:

H + BB + HBP
-----------------------
AB + BB + HBP

[edit: I'm gonna check.. I'm on a quest to find out now!!]

bakntime
03-23-04, 09:05 AM
Originally posted by Irabu's Son


I'm pretty sure errors and sacs don't count either way (not even as plate appearances) when figuring your OBP. I think it's just:

H + BB + HBP
-----------------------
AB + BB + HBP

[edit: I'm gonna check.. I'm on a quest to find out now!!]

Everything counts as a plate appearance. I'm sure of it. If you step up to the plate and there's a resulting play, it's a plate appearance. Errors count as both an at bat and a plate appearance and an 0 for 1.


From ESPN.com:
On-base percentage:
(H + BB + HBP) divided by (AB + BB + HBP + SF)


So, if you go 1 for 1 with a hit and a sacrifice, you end up with a .500 OBP, yet a 1.000 BA, since like I mentioned a sac is an 0 for 1 plate appearance yet an 0 for 0 at bat.

Irabu's Son
03-23-04, 09:24 AM
Originally posted by bakntime


Everything counts as a plate appearance. I'm sure of it. If you step up to the plate and there's a resulting play, it's a plate appearance. Errors count as both an at bat and a plate appearance and an 0 for 1.


From ESPN.com:
On-base percentage:
(H + BB + HBP) divided by (AB + BB + HBP + SF)


So, if you go 1 for 1 with a hit and a sacrifice, you end up with a .500 OBP, yet a 1.000 BA, since like I mentioned a sac is an 0 for 1 plate appearance yet an 0 for 0 at bat.

I must say, I've been a baseball fan since 1987 and I never had any clue of this. Thanks for clearing it up. I'm going to go cry now.

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 09:51 AM
Originally posted by bakntime


He's really stretching by saying that Nick will be a top 5-10 hitter. He doesn't strike me as capable of both average+power AND OBP. I think he's going to have to sacrifice his OBP to increase his SLUG, thereby, IMO, making him never more than a 900 OPS guy. A good hitter? Yes. Top 10? No.

He has yet to have a defining season, and whether injuries prevented him from doing that, or simply the fact that he's not a top 10 hitter remains to be seen, but I just don't think his ceiling is nearly the same as the Pujols, A-Rods, Delgados, Thomes, Heltons, etc, who hit for power and get on base.

There is no evidence to suggest that Nick CAN'T do those things? Can you provide your evidence for why you would think that?

NelsonMuntz
03-23-04, 10:18 AM
Originally posted by flymick24
but is javy worth johnson PLUS juan rivera and choate?

Yes. He is going to be our ace for years to come. That alone makes him invaluable. Choate was nothing more than a situational relief pitcher who lacked the control to be effective at the MLB level. Juan Rivera has about the same ceiling as Ricky Ledee. Now Johnson on the other hand is a hard player to lose. I actually would have preferred that we groomed Nick as our everyday 1st Baseman and passed on Giambi as a FA, but that is for another thread.

As another poster pointed out earlier, we were not going to acquire Vazquez for B-level prospects. And could you imagine our rotation this year without him? Leiber would be our #4 guy :scared: Either that or George would have been forced to overpay for Maddux. So at the end of the day, the Vazquez deal was a trade that Cashman had to make. Considering the fact that we already have Jason Giambi playing 1B, Johnson was expendable.

bakntime
03-23-04, 10:53 AM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


There is no evidence to suggest that Nick CAN'T do those things? Can you provide your evidence for why you would think that?

Because he's never done it on any level, including the minors. Every year it seems to be the same thing, that this year is Nick's breakout year, and if he does breakout, I'll admit I was wrong, but until then, I don't see this "huge" potential to be one of the top 10 hitters in all of baseball, let alone top 5.

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 11:00 AM
Originally posted by bakntime


Because he's never done it on any level, including the minors. Every year it seems to be the same thing, that this year is Nick's breakout year, and if he does breakout, I'll admit I was wrong, but until then, I don't see this "huge" potential to be one of the top 10 hitters in all of baseball, let alone top 5.

Nick has done it in the minors, as his career minor league line of .297/.427/.487 would indicate.

JfromJersey
03-23-04, 11:24 AM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


Nick has done it in the minors, as his career minor league line of .297/.427/.487 would indicate.

Nick had 1 great season in AA ball. That season seemed to fuel all the hyperbole about Nick and still does to a certain extent. His real strength has always been the ability to get on base, either by BB or HBP. Health has been a concern for several seasons now. If he can stay away from those nagging injuries, he can become a very good hitting and fielding 1st baseman. Someone who can hit .300 and drive in a lot of runs. I don't think he will ever become a great HR hitter, so I can't put him in the class of those other hitters mentioned.

bakntime
03-23-04, 11:31 AM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


Nick has done it in the minors, as his career minor league line of .297/.427/.487 would indicate.

A career OPS of just over the 900 mark in the minors means that he will be one of the top 10 or even 5 hitters in the majors over the next decade, as Gleeman says?

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 11:53 AM
Originally posted by bakntime


A career OPS of just over the 900 mark in the minors means that he will be one of the top 10 or even 5 hitters in the majors over the next decade, as Gleeman says?

Here are the minor league numbers for Nick Johnson and then some of the best hitters in the game today:

Nick Johnson: .297/.427/.487
Jason Giambi: .294/.403/.473
Jim Thome: .317/.413/.501
Todd Helton: .326/.414/.488
Carlos Delgado: .302/.399/.519
Jeff Bagwell: .323/.406/.439

What were you saying?

bakntime
03-23-04, 12:06 PM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


Here are the minor league numbers for Nick Johnson and then some of the best hitters in the game today:

Nick Johnson: .297/.427/.487
Jason Giambi: .294/.403/.473
Jim Thome: .317/.413/.501
Todd Helton: .326/.414/.488
Carlos Delgado: .302/.399/.519
Jeff Bagwell: .323/.406/.439

What were you saying?

Perhaps those are exceptions to the rule.... For every player you named, I could probably dig up 5 players who did the same thing in the minors but never amounted to much in the majors, but I don't have the time right now.

NJOBP36
03-23-04, 12:44 PM
Going by EqA-which is the best as far as run coorelation goes ranked Nick tied for the 9th best hitter in the AL and 19th best in baseball.

Btw, I didn't know that his isolated power was higher Thome.

bakntime
03-23-04, 12:51 PM
Originally posted by NJOBP36
Going by EqA-which is the best as far as run coorelation goes ranked Nick tied for the 9th best hitter in the AL and 19th best in baseball.

Btw, I didn't know that his isolated power was higher Thome.

Not a full season. Let me see him finish up there AND at least have the minimum number of plate appearances before we can say that he's the 19th best hitter in baseball.

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 01:09 PM
Originally posted by bakntime


Perhaps those are exceptions to the rule.... For every player you named, I could probably dig up 5 players who did the same thing in the minors but never amounted to much in the majors, but I don't have the time right now.

It's called player development. Superstars don't just arrive, it takes time, that is why players tend to get better until they head into their prime, then they level off, and then they get worse. Power is also often the last thing to develop for players. It all makes sense when you think about it.

bakntime
03-23-04, 01:12 PM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


It's called player development. Superstars don't just arrive, it takes time, that is why players tend to get better until they head into their prime, then they level off, and then they get worse. Power is also often the last thing to develop for players. It all makes sense when you think about it.

What makes sense when I think about it is that Nick has been already crowned a "top 5/10 hitter in all of baseball" without estabishing 1) He has any sort of ability to hit for average in the majors 2) He has any sort of ability to hit for power (not just homers, but slugging %) 3) He has any sort of ability to stay healthy for a full season

I just don't see how he can be so elevated without proving anything at the major league level, other than that he can take walks. That makes him a good batter, but certainly not a not top 10 hitter

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by bakntime


What makes sense when I think about it is that Nick has been already crowned a "top 5/10 hitter in all of baseball" without estabishing 1) He has any sort of ability to hit for average in the majors 2) He has any sort of ability to hit for power (not just homers, but slugging %) 3) He has any sort of ability to stay healthy for a full season

I just don't see how he can be so elevated without proving anything at the major league level, other than that he can take walks. That makes him a good batter, but certainly not a not top 10 hitter

It is already clear that he can hit for average as he has done it NUMEROUS times in the past and he has done it in 2003. He has shown PLENTY of ability to hit for power, I don't understand where you get the idea that he can't do that from. The only thing I would concede to is that he has not proven capable of playing a full season yet.

NJOBP36
03-23-04, 01:23 PM
Originally posted by bakntime


Not a full season. Let me see him finish up there AND at least have the minimum number of plate appearances before we can say that he's the 19th best hitter in baseball.

No question, I was just saying that there were only 18 better if you needed one PA. If he can't ever stay healthy, then he won't be a top 10 hitter. And slugging percentage isn't the best stat to use for power, isolated power and percentage of extra base hits are. Using isolated power, he's ahead of Giambi and tied with Bagwell. That being said if he never improves off last year he'll be a top hitter in baseball if he stays healthy.

bakntime
03-23-04, 02:28 PM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


It is already clear that he can hit for average as he has done it NUMEROUS times in the past and he has done it in 2003. He has shown PLENTY of ability to hit for power, I don't understand where you get the idea that he can't do that from. The only thing I would concede to is that he has not proven capable of playing a full season yet.

NUMEROUS times in the past? Where? What did I miss? His highest batting average is 284, and that's not even playing for a full season, and that's only once. His career major league average is .256. Plenty of ability to hit for power? In 2003, he had one homer every 23.1 ABs (his best number yet)... that's power? A .472 slugging % is power?

Even if his isloated power is good, it's a little deceptive, because you can have a crappy BA but if all your hits are doubles then you're suddenly a power hitter? Not IMO... I'll take the good batting average and less doubles over a bad batting average and more doubles, to some degree, anyway.

I'm not saying that Nick can't be one of those "big names" in all of baseball, but he certainly isn't one yet, nor is he by any means a "lock" to be one like some people are making him out to be.

SINCE77 2
03-23-04, 03:20 PM
Originally posted by bakntime


NUMEROUS times in the past? Where? What did I miss? His highest batting average is 284, and that's not even playing for a full season, and that's only once. His career major league average is .256. Plenty of ability to hit for power? In 2003, he had one homer every 23.1 ABs (his best number yet)... that's power? A .472 slugging % is power?

Even if his isloated power is good, it's a little deceptive, because you can have a crappy BA but if all your hits are doubles then you're suddenly a power hitter? Not IMO... I'll take the good batting average and less doubles over a bad batting average and more doubles, to some degree, anyway.

I'm not saying that Nick can't be one of those "big names" in all of baseball, but he certainly isn't one yet, nor is he by any means a "lock" to be one like some people are making him out to be.


I'm with you on Nick. People see visions of Thome and Giambi in Nick. I see maybe John Olerud level which is solid, but not spectacular. As you said, all he has shown at the ML level is the ability to walk. Nice trait to have, but Jeremy Giambi walks a lot and puts up offensive numbers similar to Nick and isn't considered anything special. I will always root for him to do well because of his Yankee lineage, but I always felt that many on this forum overrated him greatly.

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 03:30 PM
Originally posted by bakntime


NUMEROUS times in the past? Where? What did I miss? His highest batting average is 284, and that's not even playing for a full season, and that's only once. His career major league average is .256. Plenty of ability to hit for power? In 2003, he had one homer every 23.1 ABs (his best number yet)... that's power? A .472 slugging % is power?

Even if his isloated power is good, it's a little deceptive, because you can have a crappy BA but if all your hits are doubles then you're suddenly a power hitter? Not IMO... I'll take the good batting average and less doubles over a bad batting average and more doubles, to some degree, anyway.

I'm not saying that Nick can't be one of those "big names" in all of baseball, but he certainly isn't one yet, nor is he by any means a "lock" to be one like some people are making him out to be.

Numerous times:

A+: .317
AA: .345
MLB: .284

You doubt his power hitting, okay, of the top 10 players in slugging percentage, how many posted a slugging percentage of better than .472 before their age 25 season? Pujols, Bonds, Helton, Sheffield, A-Rod, Manny. 6 HOF level hitters. He reached .472 faster than Delgado, Edmonds, Ortiz, Nixon. This is how Johnson ranks against the BEST power hitters from last year, as judged by slugging percentage. Do you still question his power?

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 03:32 PM
Originally posted by SINCE77 2
I'm with you on Nick. People see visions of Thome and Giambi in Nick.

Perhaps because they had strikingly similar minor league careers...

bakntime
03-23-04, 03:40 PM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


Numerous times:

A+: .317
AA: .345
MLB: .284

You doubt his power hitting, okay, of the top 10 players in slugging percentage, how many posted a slugging percentage of better than .472 before their age 25 season? Pujols, Bonds, Helton, Sheffield, A-Rod, Manny. 6 HOF level hitters. He reached .472 faster than Delgado, Edmonds, Ortiz, Nixon. This is how Johnson ranks against the BEST power hitters from last year, as judged by slugging percentage. Do you still question his power?

Get back to me when he does it for a full season, and hits 15-20 homers.

Soriambi
03-23-04, 03:40 PM
I have to agree with Vito here.

A homer every 23.1 ABs, plus that SLG %, is not showing tremendous power.

Giambi :a homer every 13 ABs

Bonds: homer every 8.6 ABs

Pujols: 13.74

Sosa: 12.92

Soriano: 17.95

Sexson: 13.5

Delgado: 13.57

V. Wells: 20.54

Sheff: 14.76

Lopez: 10.62

A-rod: 12.91

Posada: 16

Ortiz: 14.41

Manny: 15.37

Thomas: 12.9

Huff: 18.7

Chavez: 20.27

That's only a few who are better than him in that aspect. He's not even close to being a top 5 hitter. Could he some day? Sure. Is he now? I don't see the argument for it, and from what I see it seems you guys are arguing whether he's a top 5 MLB hitter NOW.

bakntime
03-23-04, 03:50 PM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


Perhaps because they had strikingly similar minor league careers...

Since when do minor league numbers translate into major league numbers? Of course, that happens for some guys, but if it were that simple, there would be no players with question marks as to whether they could make it in the bigs.

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 04:12 PM
Originally posted by Soriambi
I have to agree with Vito here.

A homer every 23.1 ABs, plus that SLG %, is not showing tremendous power.

Giambi :a homer every 13 ABs

Bonds: homer every 8.6 ABs

Pujols: 13.74

Sosa: 12.92

Soriano: 17.95

Sexson: 13.5

Delgado: 13.57

V. Wells: 20.54

Sheff: 14.76

Lopez: 10.62

A-rod: 12.91

Posada: 16

Ortiz: 14.41

Manny: 15.37

Thomas: 12.9

Huff: 18.7

Chavez: 20.27

That's only a few who are better than him in that aspect. He's not even close to being a top 5 hitter. Could he some day? Sure. Is he now? I don't see the argument for it, and from what I see it seems you guys are arguing whether he's a top 5 MLB hitter NOW.

The argument is about the future, not now.

SINCE77 2
03-23-04, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


Perhaps because they had strikingly similar minor league careers...

Nick=Olerud

At this point even that comparison is a maybe. Let Nick put up a full seasons worth of numbers in the vein of a superstar hitter and then I'll believe. Until then his potential is all a bunch of smoke, mirrors, and OBP pumped up by walks.

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 04:14 PM
Originally posted by bakntime


Since when do minor league numbers translate into major league numbers? Of course, that happens for some guys, but if it were that simple, there would be no players with question marks as to whether they could make it in the bigs.

It happens when players have striking similar minor league careers, then begin their major league careers in similar fashion, in addition to being of a similar build and getting similar reports from scouts.

bakntime
03-23-04, 04:17 PM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


It happens when players have striking similar minor league careers, then begin their major league careers in similar fashion, in addition to being of a similar build and getting similar reports from scouts.

What players are you comparing him to, exactly?

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 04:25 PM
Originally posted by bakntime


What players are you comparing him to, exactly?

I think Nick Johnson will be a Thome/Giambi type.

SINCE77 2
03-23-04, 04:27 PM
Originally posted by NJASDJDH


I think Nick Johnson will be a Thome/Giambi type.


You do know that steroids are illegal. Be happy if he reaches Oleruds' level.

NJASDJDH
03-23-04, 04:34 PM
Originally posted by SINCE77 2



You do know that steroids are illegal. Be happy if he reaches Oleruds' level.

There is no evidence to suggest that Johnson WILL NOT develop the power, which would be the difference between Olerud and Thome/Giambi.

Dave in MD
03-23-04, 04:39 PM
Johnson is already better than Olerud. He won't hit for the power of Giambi, but his ba will probably be as good, with obp as good or better and slightly less slugging.

NJOBP36
03-23-04, 04:53 PM
If Nick never improves on his 2003, he's a top 20 hitter. And even when accouting for his missed time, he was the third best first baseman in the AL.