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View Full Version : Theo Defends not pursuing A-Rod



CalYankeeFan
02-19-04, 11:47 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ap-redsox-rodriguez&prov=ap&type=lgns


``Fans were really disappointed in a lot of things we didn't do last offseason. Things worked out,'' he said. ``Get used to it. Next year we'll probably be sitting here saying, `You know, you guys really wanted this player X, and player X went to the Yankees or some other team for a few million dollars more. What happened? Are you guys disappointed?' No.


I will agree with anybody that landing A-Rod guarantees nothing. But it is these kinds of statements that reflect on the attitude of the Red Sox organization. He's practically guaranteeing a championship in Boston.

http://images.usatoday.com/sports/gallery/2003-mlb-playoffs/16-redsox-dismay.jpg

cubswin
02-20-04, 12:26 AM
What is it in his statement that you didn't like? It seemed completely professional to me. He explained rationally why they went after ARod and why they didn't get him. He made a fair comparison with last year. He dared point out that the Yanks have greater resources while also acknowledging that they have more than most teams and that he didn't necessarily think there needs to be a cap. He basically said that Sox mgmt said things they shouldn't have.

CalYankeeFan
02-20-04, 12:34 AM
Originally posted by cubswin
What is it in his statement that you didn't like? It seemed completely professional to me. He explained rationally why they went after ARod and why they didn't get him. He made a fair comparison with last year. He dared point out that the Yanks have greater resources while also acknowledging that they have more than most teams and that he didn't necessarily think there needs to be a cap. He basically said that Sox mgmt said things they shouldn't have.

This part:

"Next year we'll probably be sitting here saying, `You know, you guys (fans) really wanted this player X(Who else?), and player X went to the Yankees or some other team(trying not to inflame things) for a few million dollars more(Player "x" is getting the same money?). What happened?(between now and then) Are you guys(fans) disappointed?' No"(Assuming they win the World Series they'd have no reason to be disappointed)

Professional in this case means he worded it nicely. But I think there's an underlying message. Just my opinion..

cubswin
02-20-04, 12:39 AM
Professional in this case means he worded it nicely. But I think there's an underlying message. Just my opinion.. [/B][/QUOTE]

sure, there's an underlying message, but he kind of has to have a positive message for the team and the fans, doesn't he? It's not like he denounced the Yankees and guaranteed victory.

Suggesting the fans won't be disappointed at the end of the season seems about as innocuous a claim as you can expect from somebody in his shoes, I think.

Oh - and re. the extra $ for ARod -- it's not that ARod is being paid more by the Yanks, it's that the Sox would have had to pay more to get him. He's saying yes, we made this decision b/c of money, just like we made decisions last year that you didn't like b/c of $, and just like last year turned out OK, so will this year.

yanquis1972
02-20-04, 12:45 AM
unprofessional, i think, would be using your position and access to the media as a platform to demean your opponents. epstein's response was positive as opposed to negative, and considerably more professional in that regard than henry/lucchino. epstein has always impressed me as being a well-spoken, deferential gent, although i'm convinced there's one nasty dude underneath. but i guess there has to be in this business.

CalYankeeFan
02-20-04, 12:59 AM
Originally posted by cubswin

sure, there's an underlying message, but he kind of has to have a positive message for the team and the fans, doesn't he? It's not like he denounced the Yankees and guaranteed victory.

I think he said it without coming straight out and saying it. Of course, in his position he has to be positive, politically correct, etc. Cashman does the same thing. He's saying the end result will be that fans won't be disappointed. The only way Boston fans won't be disappointed is if they beat the Yankees and win the Series...he starts it all off by saying "Next year we will probably...."


Suggesting the fans won't be disappointed at the end of the season seems about as innocuous a claim as you can expect from somebody in his shoes, I think.

When it comes to playoff caliber teams, the joy isn't in just getting there. Anything less than winning the Series after being one of the final 8 is disappointing. I was disappointed last year..big time. In football, there are some Carolina Panthers fans that are disappointed.


Oh - and re. the extra $ for ARod -- it's not that ARod is being paid more by the Yanks, it's that the Sox would have had to pay more to get him. He's saying yes, we made this decision b/c of money, just like we made decisions last year that you didn't like b/c of $, and just like last year turned out OK, so will this year.

The MLBPA rejected the contract because A-Rod was going to take a paycut - or at least the value of the contract was going to be less. I understand what you are saying though...you are looking at it from the teams eyes, I was looking at it from the player's.

Did last year turn out OK for this guy?;) Will the same result this year be OK?

http://pro.corbis.com/images/DWF15-456945.jpg?size=67&uid={1d91d2c6-7dfa-4342-b344-775176207b44}

CalYankeeFan
02-20-04, 01:02 AM
Originally posted by yanquis1972
unprofessional, i think, would be using your position and access to the media as a platform to demean your opponents. epstein's response was positive as opposed to negative, and considerably more professional in that regard than henry/lucchino. epstein has always impressed me as being a well-spoken, deferential gent, although i'm convinced there's one nasty dude underneath. but i guess there has to be in this business.

I agree...he's professional. He even tried to soften the blow of Henry's comments. I think most GM's have to be that way, because they are the ones that deal with one another all the time. The owner's can probably get away with spouting off a little more. Even in the heat of the rivalry I don't think you'd see Cash and Epstein say negative things about one another.

yanquis1972
02-20-04, 01:05 AM
good point, but i still don't see anything wrong with what he said. unless you think optimism is a bad thing (I do, but not when it's coming from my opponents).

CalYankeeFan
02-20-04, 01:08 AM
Originally posted by yanquis1972
good point, but i still don't see anything wrong with what he said. unless you think optimism is a bad thing (I do, but not when it's coming from my opponents).

Optimism isn't a bad thing...saying they are going to be competitive, have a great year, be in the race etc....

Again, JMO, to say people won't be disappointed is stretching it....

I'm not trying to cause controversy, that's just how I see it.

NDBoston
02-20-04, 06:33 AM
Originally posted by CalYankeeFan


Optimism isn't a bad thing...saying they are going to be competitive, have a great year, be in the race etc....

Again, JMO, to say people won't be disappointed is stretching it....

I'm not trying to cause controversy, that's just how I see it.

Do you think your hated towards the Red Sox might influence the way you see this?

Pedro's cuff
02-20-04, 06:37 AM
Oh come on ND, that's just flat out specious to say.

NDBoston
02-20-04, 06:44 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Pedro's cuff
Oh come on ND, that's just flat out specious to say. [/QUOT

:lol:

nyyfanatic85
02-20-04, 06:47 AM
I don't see anything wrong with the quote. Big deal.

Pedro's cuff
02-20-04, 06:56 AM
I think the "No." at the end goes with the following sentence. It makes no sense there on its own.


``Fans were really disappointed in a lot of things we didn't do last offseason. Things worked out,'' he said. ``Get used to it. Next year we'll probably be sitting here saying, `You know, you guys really wanted this player X, and player X went to the Yankees or some other team for a few million dollars more. What happened? Are you guys disappointed?' No. We're going to build a team, a team for which the whole is greater than the sum of the parts, and that's what I think we have here.'


Come on everyone, give them a break, they're just poor illiterate sportswriters. Some things can't be helped.

Babe Rules
02-20-04, 07:15 AM
The deals:
we'll pay A-Rod 112Mi per seven years
Bosux will sill pay Manny something like 120 for six years
I Know we lost Sori for that, but however...

Babe Rules
02-20-04, 08:15 AM
Another thing: They're saying that, but last saturday or sunday when Boston saw that we're getting ARod they offered to take his contract just the way it was (the moment when A-Rod told them to Fu*k Off).

NDBoston
02-20-04, 08:17 AM
Originally posted by Babe Rules
Another thing: They're saying that, but last saturday or sunday when Boston saw that we're getting ARod they offered to take his contract just the way it was (the moment when A-Rod told them to Fu*k Off).

That was denied by Theo Epstein and the GM of the Rangers.

It did sell a few papers in NY though.

Pedro's cuff
02-20-04, 08:21 AM
It's 2004's version of the Costa Rican hotel room chair being broken.

jonnyc39
02-20-04, 09:32 AM
Originally posted by Babe Rules
Another thing: They're saying that, but last saturday or sunday when Boston saw that we're getting ARod they offered to take his contract just the way it was (the moment when A-Rod told them to Fu*k Off).

That would have been a pretty strange thing dor A-Rod to say, considering he asked the Rangers to re-open negotiations with the Red Sox just days before. Don't believe everything you read.

cubswin
02-20-04, 10:54 AM
Plus, whatever you thin about ARod (I have nothing against the guy and think he's the best player in the game), he's supposed to be very polished, savvy and professional off the field. Telling a prospective boss to "f*ck off," through a "mutual friend," no less, seems to contradict all of that. Plus, not sure there's a lot of reason for it -- Sox and he and Hicks had negotiated a deal that was to all of their liking. (Perhaps argument could be made that he would say it due to Lucchino's comments after the union scuttled the deal, which some have characterized as trying to drive a wedge b/t ARod and the union. But I'd still go back to my first 2 points.)

BombersBlvd
02-20-04, 11:57 PM
Originally posted by cubswin
Plus, whatever you thin about ARod (I have nothing against the guy and think he's the best player in the game), he's supposed to be very polished, savvy and professional off the field. Telling a prospective boss to "f*ck off," through a "mutual friend," no less, seems to contradict all of that. Plus, not sure there's a lot of reason for it -- Sox and he and Hicks had negotiated a deal that was to all of their liking. (Perhaps argument could be made that he would say it due to Lucchino's comments after the union scuttled the deal, which some have characterized as trying to drive a wedge b/t ARod and the union. But I'd still go back to my first 2 points.)

I find it hard to believe that A-Rod would say something like what's being suggested in some reports, but I find it impossible to believe that the Red Sox didn't make a last ditch effort to go all out and acquire him once they realized that the Yankees were involved. Those who seriously contend that Larry and Theo did little except schedule a jam session w/ Peter Gammons this past weekend are likely in denial.

cubswin
02-21-04, 12:33 AM
Originally posted by BombersBlvd


I find it hard to believe that A-Rod would say something like what's being suggested in some reports, but I find it impossible to believe that the Red Sox didn't make a last ditch effort to go all out and acquire him once they realized that the Yankees were involved. Those who seriously contend that Larry and Theo did little except schedule a jam session w/ Peter Gammons this past weekend are likely in denial.


I'd be surprised, and pissed, if they didn't make a last-ditch effort to get him. The analysis of what you're willing to spend to get him changes as you come to believe your biggest competitor is going to get him in a deal improving themselves.

Pedro's cuff
02-21-04, 06:07 AM
You should be seriously pissed if they made a panicked last ditch move to acquire him after walking away because the deal didn't make financial sense.

That was a staple of the Duquette era, sign a big name guy no matter what the cost while doing nothing toward building a team to win. It's silly to do everything in terms of what the Yankees do unless you're playing them 162 times a season. When you do things for PR reasons or for the acceptance of the fans, you'll be unemployed sooner rather than later.

cubswin
02-21-04, 02:50 PM
Panicked last-ditch move? I agree. (And, frankly, I didn't like the trade in the first place.) However, there is a difference in the player's value to him if you are (i) sure he'll stay with his current team, (ii) likely to play for your rival in a deal that improves them and (iii) certain to play for your rival in a deal that improves them. I don't believe that the Sox should have mortgaged their future to keep him from the Yankees, but I do think it warranted a renewed effort at some level beyond where they originally were.

And I don't think it is at all comparable to Duquette. He didn;t do things for PR value, he did things for his own ego (IMO).

Pedro's cuff
02-21-04, 06:27 PM
more days in first place...more days in first place. I'm still waiting for Offerman to replace Mo's OBP. But I digress.

cubswin
02-21-04, 08:37 PM
"more days in first place"? Offerman was a nice pick-up... wonder how Mo's career would have unfolded had he stayed?