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Panamaniac42
10-29-14, 04:46 PM
Back for another hit of the drug I can't quit.

I'm digging what Phil's done thus far and like the realistic expectations for this season (we'll see how long Dolan sits still). Hopefully they can make some noise, grab a 7th or 8th seed, and spend some $ in 2015.

It's your show, Slim...

http://i.imgur.com/1nQpSA9.jpg

http://www.coachesclipboard.net/TriangleOffense.html

awy
10-29-14, 06:48 PM
i don't see the triangle being an immediate improvement. it's more likely a long term, team culture kind of thing. you need some key pieces to become leaders on the team to instill that culture, and with the present group it is easy to not see anyone like that. i was listenign to a fisher interview with francesa and he was talking about stuff like "focusing on the current play and not argue about who should have gotten the shot on the last play."

i mean, come the ................ on. if that is the current state of the team it tells me they are a long way off, but also explains why they were so bad.

bcom33
10-30-14, 12:24 AM
The team has a long way to go to figure out this system.

At least Amar'e looked decent in the first quarter on offense. Of course his knees will give out in a few weeks, but until then we'll have some fun.

Yankee Tripper
10-30-14, 02:54 PM
I could be wrong but I think the only thing Knick fans are going to have to look forward to this season is the $34M coming off the books in A'mare and Bargani's expiring contracts.

GordonGecko
10-30-14, 03:25 PM
I could be wrong but I think the only thing Knick fans are going to have to look forward to this season is the $34M coming off the books in A'mare and Bargani's expiring contracts.

Amare playing well, he might get traded

Yankee Tripper
10-30-14, 04:43 PM
Amare playing well, he might get traded
In the crazy world of NBA salary caps, expiring contracts and generating cap space, stranger things have happened but even so moving his $23M salary will be a difficult task for Phil.

GordonGecko
10-30-14, 09:57 PM
In the crazy world of NBA salary caps, expiring contracts and generating cap space, stranger things have happened but even so moving his $23M salary will be a difficult task for Phil.

by the trade deadline that's more like a $8M rental

and oh, KNICKS WIN~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LeBust

awy
10-30-14, 11:15 PM
hahaha ................ the cavs

GordonGecko
10-30-14, 11:37 PM
http://l.yimg.com/os/publish-images/sports/2014-10-31/743c6330-60b1-11e4-bf9a-05432d8b7fa6_LeBron-James-won-t-be-happy-with-his-performance-David-Richard-USA-TODAY-Sports-.jpg

Yankee Tripper
10-31-14, 01:32 PM
:lol: Homecoming not so sweet for LeBron. I still think it's going to a tough season for the Knicks.

THEBOSS84
11-01-14, 07:57 AM
Melo is the Mark Teixeira of the Knicks. Just shut up. How many times over the past few months have I read him say "it's one of the reasons I came back"? The reason he came back was the money. Stop trying to play us for fools.

GordonGecko
11-01-14, 08:04 AM
Melo is the Mark Teixeira of the Knicks. Just shut up. How many times over the past few months have I read him say "it's one of the reasons I came back"? The reason he came back was the money. Stop trying to play us for fools.

Huh, why are you hating on Melo. The Knicks are nothing without him

Tex is the opposite of Melo, he's completely useless

fredgmuggs
11-01-14, 08:19 AM
Melo is the Mark Teixeira of the Knicks. Just shut up. How many times over the past few months have I read him say "it's one of the reasons I came back"? The reason he came back was the money. Stop trying to play us for fools.

The only thing he cares about (besides the money) is getting his shots per game every night. He's not a guy you build a team around.

GordonGecko
11-01-14, 08:32 AM
lol, you people are crazy

awy
11-01-14, 09:04 AM
too much melo hate

THEBOSS84
11-01-14, 09:12 AM
Huh, why are you hating on Melo. The Knicks are nothing without him

Tex is the opposite of Melo, he's completely useless

I didn't mean in terms of production, obviously. I meant in terms of annoying, self-serving sound bytes.

HelloNewman
11-01-14, 09:21 AM
Amare playing well, he might get tradedugh, wouldn't it be better to keep him and let the money melt off? they're not going to do anything notable this year anyway. Trading him for another salary sounds so "Dolan."

HelloNewman
11-01-14, 09:31 AM
i don't see the triangle being an immediate improvement.\Except for a few overwrought sportswriters, who does? It's a floor-spacing technique. Get Kevin Durant in here in a few years (2016), we have a Triangle. If your players can't shoot/score, it's newspaper fodder, no more no less

Snatch Catch
11-02-14, 07:10 PM
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/knicks/post/_/id/59493/fish-triangle-hard-to-recognize-sometimes


Knicks coach Derek Fisher was asked if his team played some non-triangle sets in the win over Cleveland or if he had simplified the offense a bit following the season-opening loss to Chicago.

“Well, no, I think it is hard for folks that haven’t played in this before to recognize when it is and when it isn’t,” Fisher explained. “So there are tons of things that we can do before and after that start in a triangle, end in a triangle, maybe there is no triangle.

“That is for us to know and everybody else to find out,” Fisher added with a chuckle.


“But there are ways that we get in and out of it that just gives a defense a different look,” Fisher added. “And it obviously gives the broadcasters a different look so I guess it is working well so far.”

GordonGecko
11-03-14, 10:43 AM
With the obvious exception of the Bulls game, the Knicks are playing very respectably under this new regime. If they can manage to beat the crappy/mediocre teams consitently and pull an upset here and there like with the cavs, the playoffs will be within reach

Panamaniac42
11-04-14, 07:12 PM
J.R. & Jason Smith looking like Marbury & Doleac with that pick-and-pop connection.

awy
11-04-14, 07:25 PM
With the obvious exception of the Bulls game, the Knicks are playing very respectably under this new regime. If they can manage to beat the crappy/mediocre teams consitently and pull an upset here and there like with the cavs, the playoffs will be within reach

must say fisher has far exceeded my expectations.

Panamaniac42
11-04-14, 08:42 PM
Pierce just owns the Knicks.

eaganmafia
11-05-14, 02:57 PM
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/11/05/knicks-j-r-smith-suspended-one-game-for-shot-to-glen-ricesum-groin/

JR is a moron

Panamaniac42
11-05-14, 07:22 PM
I like this guy.

<iframe class="vine-embed" src="https://vine.co/v/OeMarYz11H3/embed/simple" width="320" height="320" frameborder="0"></iframe><script async src="//platform.vine.co/static/scripts/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Panamaniac42
11-05-14, 07:23 PM
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/11/05/knicks-j-r-smith-suspended-one-game-for-shot-to-glen-ricesum-groin/

JR is a moron

He did a pretty good job of selling it as a "clear out" but I guess they analyzed the sh*t out of it after Rice complained.

Panamaniac42
11-05-14, 08:52 PM
Well this negates the Cleveland win.

Yankees1962
11-06-14, 03:45 AM
When are you guys going to learn? This season is going to be a long struggle and I seriously doubt they make the playoffs. I just hope they don't get stupid and make a dumb move like acquiring Kobe or some other quick fix move that will backfire in the end.

GordonGecko
11-06-14, 12:47 PM
they'll make the playoffs, not worried about that

Panamaniac42
11-06-14, 09:27 PM
When are you guys going to learn? This season is going to be a long struggle and I seriously doubt they make the playoffs. I just hope they don't get stupid and make a dumb move like acquiring Kobe or some other quick fix move that will backfire in the end.

Who needs to learn what? I didn't see anyone in this thread being unrealistic.

After the first game they were the worst team in the league, after the second game they were the best team in the league, but I think we all know they're somewhere in between and it's going to be a process.

If they start making quick fix moves then Phil isn't who we thought he was.

dabomb2045
11-07-14, 12:10 AM
This season really doesnt matter. At best, they are a 7-8 seed that loses in the 1st round. Its all about what Phil can do in FA the next two offseasons. Its up to him to add the pieces that make this team a title contender.

awy
11-07-14, 04:51 PM
get marc gasol pls

Yankees1962
11-11-14, 09:14 AM
Who needs to learn what? I didn't see anyone in this thread being unrealistic.

After the first game they were the worst team in the league, after the second game they were the best team in the league, but I think we all know they're somewhere in between and it's going to be a process.

If they start making quick fix moves then Phil isn't who we thought he was.
I think they're one of the worse teams in the league so we'll see how the reminder of this season plays out.

awy
11-11-14, 09:36 AM
looking at some early numbers they seem to be playing different on offense at least, and that's the biggest area of change.

the problem with them losing largely is due to the defense, particularly 3 point defense. might be a bit of bad luck there as well but they've been atrocious

Panamaniac42
11-11-14, 10:10 AM
the problem with them losing largely is due to the defense, particularly 3 point defense. might be a bit of bad luck there as well but they've been atrocious

Yeah, even after Korver torched them in Atlanta, they still let him get good looks. They were fortunate he only hit 3/9 from deep instead of 6/9 (still lost, so whatever).

Also, Dalembert looks awful; I didn't realize he was such an incompetent defender. Early in the 1st last night he attempted a close-out on Horford...Dalembert looked like he was on Xanax and Horford easily went around him for an easy dunk.

THEBOSS84
11-11-14, 03:37 PM
Not wishing injury on anyone, but the best thing for this franchise would be if Melo was out and they end up with the first pick - Okafor.

awy
11-11-14, 04:35 PM
there's nothing that prevents them from tanking the season with melo right this moment. but lots of other teams also tanking so it's still a luck thing



i mean, unless they want the first round exit that badly

SLURPEE
11-15-14, 08:25 AM
This team isn't good. Even with Melo. I don't mind them sucking and getting a top pick. Although there isn't any game changers in this year's draft, they need to add young talent. No one is going to give them that. Look at their youngest players (Shumpert/Hardaway) they're via the draft.

I really wish Phil let Melo go and broke it down. I wouldn't had mind re-signing Melo if he was 25. because they could break it down and still he'd be young enough when they're ready to win. but at 30 and still sucking, will he still be good when it's time to contend?

Sixty one
11-15-14, 11:09 AM
I wonder how long it is going to take before the Knicks are back as contenders....one year, two, five??

THEBOSS84
11-15-14, 11:18 AM
I wonder how long it is going to take before the Knicks are back as contenders....one year, two, five??

If they manage their payroll well, it can be as early as next year. That's pretty much what we've been waiting for over the last 2-3 years - some contracts to expire.

awy
11-15-14, 11:50 AM
beyond the picks this season is about building a winning culture and executive effectiveness at the coaching level. i would ignore all single game negatives and focus on positive trends

kan_t
11-16-14, 08:49 PM
This team isn't good. Even with Melo. I don't mind them sucking and getting a top pick. Although there isn't any game changers in this year's draft, they need to add young talent. No one is going to give them that. Look at their youngest players (Shumpert/Hardaway) they're via the draft.

I really wish Phil let Melo go and broke it down. I wouldn't had mind re-signing Melo if he was 25. because they could break it down and still he'd be young enough when they're ready to win. but at 30 and still sucking, will he still be good when it's time to contend?
Okafor?

awy
11-17-14, 06:02 AM
they need a two way player. the defense on that team is just horrifying

SLURPEE
11-17-14, 08:31 AM
I looked at some mock drafts. Some have the Knicks taking a SF, which is bizarre.

Panamaniac42
11-17-14, 09:33 AM
I looked at some mock drafts. Some have the Knicks taking a SF, which is bizarre.

Those are probably the ones that just list best players available and then line em up with teams by standings. Any mocks I've seen with intelligent analysis went PF/C or PG.

Snatch Catch
11-17-14, 11:54 AM
If they end up in a top draft position, Towns is screaming so loudly to this organization right now. It'll be interesting to see how he performs at UK.

awy
11-18-14, 10:29 PM
towns is a huge knicks fan apparently. sign him nao

just-blaze
11-18-14, 11:10 PM
Glad to see I'm not the only one to tank.......but knowing our luck, I can definitely see us ending up with the 10th pick.

Unless Silver wants to have a Stern/Ewing moment (fingers crossed)

Panamaniac42
11-19-14, 09:46 AM
If Melo has something wrong with his knee, this is the year to get it cleaned up and rest while the team loses its way to a better pick.

This was nasty, by the way:

http://fat.gfycat.com/BackZestyChimpanzee.gif

SLURPEE
11-19-14, 05:25 PM
Okafor?

Sorry, I don't watch college sports. He's a big prospect?

I don't think the Knicks or Lakers will get the number 1 pick. Too many conspiracy theorist will claim the NBA fixed the lottery. I'm not one, but I do think once in awhile the the lottery is fixed. ex. D. Rose.

Yankee Tripper
11-20-14, 01:43 PM
they'll make the playoffs, not worried about that
Now that they are 3-10 aganst one of the easiest schedules in the NBA so far are you still confident?

awy
11-20-14, 03:30 PM
making the playoffs in teh tanking game

bcom33
11-20-14, 03:45 PM
I'm not completely giving up on the team until Calderon is back. I wanna see what kind of difference he can make.

GordonGecko
11-20-14, 04:16 PM
Now that they are 3-10 aganst one of the easiest schedules in the NBA so far are you still confident?

absolutely not! this team is full of turkeys who can't find the second half of the court

the team is getting gutted after the season

awy
11-24-14, 08:08 AM
we have some interesting pieces.

dalembert is actually one of the best rim protectors so far.
http://cf.datawrapper.de/Gx44C/3/

hardaway continuing to progress.

http://www.82games.com/1415/1415NYK.HTM

there's the notable heavy stones of jason smith and larkin.

SLURPEE
11-24-14, 09:16 AM
Only two wins with an easy schedule. Haven't played one good team from the West. No big injuries. Even with Calderon, looks like 20-25 win team.

Yankees1962
11-25-14, 04:02 AM
Only two wins with an easy schedule. Haven't played one good team from the West. No big injuries. Even with Calderon, looks like 20-25 win team.
It might be worse if Melo's back injury is serious. They should have let him walk.

awy
11-25-14, 08:45 AM
melo is still a truly great player in the league. people overlook the central role he has for the offense. it's like +20 points per 100 possession.

Yankee Tripper
11-25-14, 12:44 PM
melo is still a truly great player in the league. people overlook the central role he has for the offense. it's like +20 points per 100 possession.
Melo is a dynamic scorer but if he's your #1 guy you will never go far in the playoffs with him.

awy
11-25-14, 01:51 PM
that's not really true. within the right defensive scheme melo can be hidden like dirk was on the mavs team. knicks even had chandler

SLURPEE
11-25-14, 03:28 PM
This team might end up sucking enough to get a top pick anyway but Phil should of purposely put together a bad team. Knicks need young talent. Being mediocre doesn't help. Get a prospect, FA and Melo, couple of smart trades, may have something next year.

I still fear they somehow end up with 35-40 wins and miss out on the lottery. smh

awy
11-25-14, 04:12 PM
yea they really need to go into hard tank mode. let melo take his time coming back and drill the guys on defense defense defense. there is no reason why they should be that bad on D

SLURPEE
12-05-14, 08:41 AM
4-16. Looks like the Knick players want Okafor too.

Yankees1962
12-05-14, 08:48 AM
4-16. Looks like the Knick players want Okafor too.
Keep it up guys, as this team is so messed up they need to get better and younger talent in there.

bcom33
12-06-14, 12:21 AM
yea they really need to go into hard tank mode. let melo take his time coming back and drill the guys on defense defense defense. there is no reason why they should be that bad on D

My only fear, is that if we take Melo out of the lineup, we might accidentally start winning like we did on that short stretch a few years ago with Lin and Amar'e playing like beasts.

THEBOSS84
12-06-14, 09:16 AM
It's almost like they should have listened to me when I begged them not to sign Melo..

GordonGecko
12-07-14, 11:51 PM
I don't see how this is any of Melo's fault, nor how signing him in any way handcuffs the team's future

THEBOSS84
12-08-14, 08:36 AM
I don't see how this is any of Melo's fault, nor how signing him in any way handcuffs the team's future

Never said it's Melo's fault, but he's window-dressing on a sh*t team now, and he's only going to get worse as the deal goes on.

SLURPEE
12-09-14, 11:52 AM
Knick schedule is brutal. Only possible win is the Celtics. Tonight through Christmas, all L's.

awy
12-09-14, 12:14 PM
should be clear now that tanking is the way to go.

Yankee Tripper
12-09-14, 12:17 PM
Knick schedule is brutal. Only possible win is the Celtics. Tonight through Christmas, all L's.
When you are game ahead of Philly, every game looks brutal.

GordonGecko
12-09-14, 05:36 PM
Pretty amazing though that even with all this the Knicks are only 5.5 games out of a playoff spot with 75% of the season left to play. There is still a chance for the team to click and make a run to a first round exit and lose their lottery ball lol

Vin
12-09-14, 07:57 PM
Nice breakdown of the Knicks triangle offense.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNyKnN9AMIE

bcom33
12-10-14, 10:32 AM
Nice article on 'Melo and his little band of losers:

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/12008328/new-york-knicks-carmelo-anthony-heart-team-discord-sources-say

GordonGecko
12-10-14, 10:39 AM
Nice article on 'Melo and his little band of losers:

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/12008328/new-york-knicks-carmelo-anthony-heart-team-discord-sources-say

Damn, that's bad - real bad.

Maybe it's time to throw it in and just trade Melo, no-trade clause and all. We can load up on draft picks and get some scrubs with upside. This season is done and if all that is true then Melo will never fit into the Jackson system

bcom33
12-10-14, 10:44 AM
Damn, that's bad - real bad.

Maybe it's time to throw it in and just trade Melo, no-trade clause and all. We can load up on draft picks and get some scrubs with upside. This season is done and if all that is true then Melo will never fit into the Jackson system

That's the sense I've gotten from this season. I don't think 'Melo is willing to change his game to win, unless he's on a team of other all stars who he can't tell to eff off when they ask him to rebound.

SLURPEE
12-10-14, 11:47 AM
I think they should have just let Melo go. Or sign and trade him. The only reason why Phil re-signed him was to possibly attract other free-agents.
Had he been 25/26, I would have no problem giving him that contract. But by the time the Knicks are a legit contender, he will likely be showing signs of aging.

GordonGecko
12-10-14, 12:35 PM
Regardless of all that, if he's literally not willing to "play ball", then he's worthless to this team

eaganmafia
12-10-14, 12:45 PM
Is Melo being a selfish player really anything new here? I don't Melo suddenly became this type of player overnight. This is what the Knicks and Phil wanted...you got your franchise player.

I'll chalk a lot of this up to a bunch of guys being very frustrated with losing. But Melo shooting too much and not playing defense...alert the media the Lindbergh baby is missing.

GordonGecko
12-10-14, 04:14 PM
I've been hearing that Melo might go in for knee surgery

Vin
12-10-14, 10:28 PM
"But some of it's just basketball stuff that the players don't like doing. When somebody's demanding that you make a hard cut, you don't like it because you have to work harder. When someone says it's not OK to throw a bulls--- pass, guys don't like it."

Sounds like they don't want to work hard.

dabomb2045
12-10-14, 10:44 PM
Sounds like they don't want to work hard.

Such is life when your roster is full of losers that have no concept of doing what it takes to be a winner.

GordonGecko
12-11-14, 07:35 AM
Such is life when your roster is full of losers that have no concept of doing what it takes to be a winner.

Each guy knows how to be a whiner, does that count for anything??

SLURPEE
12-11-14, 09:15 AM
5-26 by the end of Christmas...

GordonGecko
12-11-14, 10:54 AM
Well the Carmelo re-signing may turn out to be a blessing in disguise. The Knicks suck so bad even with him that he'll want out and we can load up on mid level talent & draft picks in a trade. Keep tanking, maybe our lottery ball will bounce the right way next draft

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/12/sports/basketball/carmelo-anthony-knicks-rebuild-might-be-better-off-as-a-tear-down.html

bcom33
12-11-14, 12:07 PM
Well the Carmelo re-signing may turn out to be a blessing in disguise. The Knicks suck so bad even with him that he'll want out and we can load up on mid level talent & draft picks in a trade. Keep tanking, maybe our lottery ball will bounce the right way next draft

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/12/sports/basketball/carmelo-anthony-knicks-rebuild-might-be-better-off-as-a-tear-down.html

While part of me definitely wants this, another part of me would like Derek Fisher to prove that he can actually coach, as well. That'd be good to see.

THEBOSS84
12-11-14, 12:39 PM
A top 5 pick to go along with cap space - that's what I dream of for these Knicks.

Sixty one
12-11-14, 01:47 PM
How many years to rebuild this team?? One, two or more? I can't believe that they still have sold out crowds for every game. I wonder how long that will be until the fans start looking elsewhere for their pro basketball fix?

GordonGecko
12-11-14, 01:50 PM
How many years to rebuild this team?? One, two or more? I can't believe that they still have sold out crowds for every game. I wonder how long that will be until the fans start looking elsewhere for their pro basketball fix?

Not only that, but crowds that pay a fortune to see games. The average secondary market ticket is still something like $280. But after the past week, things have started to fall apart. If Melo goes in for surgery the whole ticket market will crash. People will still want to go, but they'll be looking for $75 tickets downstairs instead of $400, and $25 nosebleeds instead of $60. It took several years of destruction by Isiah Thomas before people stopped coming, things could be a lot worse

Yankee Tripper
12-11-14, 02:48 PM
How many years to rebuild this team?? One, two or more? I can't believe that they still have sold out crowds for every game. I wonder how long that will be until the fans start looking elsewhere for their pro basketball fix?
That will hinge on what FAs they can attract next summer and if they hit a home run with next spring's draft pick or not because they don't have a 2016 pick. [sarcasm on]The Bargani trade just get's better and better.[/sarcasm off]

Yankee Tripper
12-11-14, 05:44 PM
I'm sorry Knock fans but I found this hysterical
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B4i8pcuIMAAqr17.jpg

SLURPEE
12-11-14, 06:48 PM
How many years to rebuild this team?? One, two or more? I can't believe that they still have sold out crowds for every game. I wonder how long that will be until the fans start looking elsewhere for their pro basketball fix?

Realistically, two years. Next Summer FA is not looking so hot. Quiet rumors Gasol is staying put. 2016 looks to be the year: Noah, Anthony Davis....

They should be better next year. They better be because the Raptors have their pick...

RhodyYanksFan
12-12-14, 07:40 AM
How many years to rebuild this team?? One, two or more? I can't believe that they still have sold out crowds for every game. I wonder how long that will be until the fans start looking elsewhere for their pro basketball fix?

Haven't they been rebuilding since Ewing retired??

dabomb2045
12-12-14, 07:42 AM
I'm sorry Knock fans but I found this hysterical
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B4i8pcuIMAAqr17.jpg

Mr. Mop probably has better shot selection then JR, and plays better D then Hardaway.

GordonGecko
12-12-14, 08:11 AM
Haven't they been rebuilding since Ewing retired??

They've been rebuilding since Dolan was in charge. I saw him in the Delta Club at the Rangers game on Monday and he looked completely miserable. His biggest success in life is being born

dabomb2045
12-12-14, 11:15 AM
You mean it's not JD and the Straight Sh....errrr, ok never mind.

SLURPEE
12-17-14, 12:19 PM
I did the Win Loss thing with the schedule. I have them at 18-20 wins. Most against the Pistons, Celtics, Magic, 76's....

I would clean house. Including Melo.

dabomb2045
12-18-14, 06:08 PM
Its ugly as possible right now. We must win the lottery. I also cant think of any good reasons why a star FA would come here. If you are Marc Gasol or LMA, why on earth would you leave good situations to come to this mess?

GordonGecko
12-18-14, 06:42 PM
Its ugly as possible right now. We must win the lottery. I also cant think of any good reasons why a star FA would come here. If you are Marc Gasol or LMA, why on earth would you leave good situations to come to this mess?

You wouldn't - it's pretty hopeless

Yankees1962
12-18-14, 07:57 PM
You wouldn't - it's pretty hopeless
Which is why signing Melo was the wrong move.

awy
12-18-14, 08:58 PM
why are they winning. stop.

kan_t
12-18-14, 10:14 PM
why are they winning. stop.
It really doesn't matter as long as they are in the lottery pool.

GordonGecko
12-20-14, 02:46 PM
Knicks in full panic mode having $49/ticket fire sale
http://www.groupon.com/deals/gl-new-york-knicks-1-1-1

SLURPEE
12-20-14, 03:22 PM
You know if the Knicks or Lakers win the lottery, people will claim the fix was in. :lol:
Funny, didn't hear anything about a fix when the 9th ranked Bulls somehow landed hometown boy Derrick Rose.

(btw. I do think it is fix at times. no one believes it unless it's Knicks/Lakers and maybe C's)


Okafor
Melo
Dragic

:drool:

THEBOSS84
12-20-14, 03:28 PM
Even if Philly wins the lottery, I'd wonder if they'd select Okafor, considering they just drafted Embid and Noels.

montrealer
12-20-14, 03:35 PM
Wish the Sixers would win the lottery.........:(

awy
12-20-14, 03:51 PM
You know if the Knicks or Lakers win the lottery, people will claim the fix was in. :lol:
Funny, didn't hear anything about a fix when the 9th ranked Bulls somehow landed hometown boy Derrick Rose.

(btw. I do think it is fix at times. no one believes it unless it's Knicks/Lakers and maybe C's)


Okafor
Melo
Dragic

:drool:the fix was always in with the nba draft. that whole league

GordonGecko
12-20-14, 04:18 PM
the fix was always in with the nba draft. that whole league

Not hard to argue that when you have NBA refs taking payoffs to call games a certain way

SLURPEE
12-29-14, 02:38 PM
5-28 woof! I think 18 wins. Going to be pissed if they don't get at least the 2nd overall pick.

GordonGecko
12-29-14, 04:51 PM
5-28 woof! I think 18 wins. Going to be pissed if they don't get at least the 2nd overall pick.
it's mostly random so they could walk away with jack

I'm just hoping the Knicks trade Melo because apparently the guy is a born loser

Yankees1962
12-29-14, 05:19 PM
it's mostly random so they could walk away with jack

I'm just hoping the Knicks trade Melo because apparently the guy is a born loser

Make up your mind, you were one of the few of us that wanted to re-sign him.

GordonGecko
12-29-14, 06:42 PM
Make up your mind, you were one of the few of us that wanted to re-sign him.

Don't think we had much choice to re-sign, because the Knicks had no one without him. I thought he would at least carry the team for a few games and buy into Phil's system, but apparently he's a stubborn mule that refuses to adapt. I am severely disappointed in the guy, I thought we would see more of the player that came off team USA and led the team to the playoffs. I've lost all respect for Melo

awy
12-31-14, 12:21 AM
trade melo for cousins.

Vin
01-01-15, 04:07 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qwxbD2QAc#t=49

Panamaniac42
01-02-15, 02:42 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qwxbD2QAc#t=49


How's his defense? (I have to ask thanks to what we've seen from Amar'e.)


I never though they'd be leading the NBA in losses at this point, but I'm glad they've taken this route instead of pointless mediocrity.

awy
01-02-15, 02:46 PM
defense not elite

THEBOSS84
01-02-15, 03:01 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qwxbD2QAc#t=49

If the Knicks can win the lotto/Okafor, I can convince myself to forget about the last 15 years.

bcom33
01-02-15, 10:17 PM
If the Knicks can win the lotto/Okafor, I can convince myself to forget about the last 15 years.

As a Duke fan, I agree, haha. He'd be fun to watch develop. As it stands now, he needs to become more athletic and stronger. His defense needs to improve to be a more complete player. He does remind me of what Carlos Boozer was like in college, except (CRUCIALLY) he has the height that Boozer never had, which leads me to believe he'll have a better career.

We do need a real point guard worse than a center, though. It will be interesting to see if they have an opportunity to decide between Okafor and Mudiay, who they end up going with. As far as I can tell, Mudiay can't shoot, so I'd prefer Okafor.

dabomb2045
01-03-15, 01:21 AM
If the Knicks can win the lotto/Okafor, I can convince myself to forget about the last 15 years.

So could I but I fully expect us to get screwed in the lottery and end up picking 4th or something. Its the Knicks way. Then next year we can return to our normal state of not having a 1st round pick.

SLURPEE
01-03-15, 07:54 PM
As a Duke fan, I agree, haha. He'd be fun to watch develop. As it stands now, he needs to become more athletic and stronger. His defense needs to improve to be a more complete player. He does remind me of what Carlos Boozer was like in college, except (CRUCIALLY) he has the height that Boozer never had, which leads me to believe he'll have a better career.

We do need a real point guard worse than a center, though. It will be interesting to see if they have an opportunity to decide between Okafor and Mudiay, who they end up going with. As far as I can tell, Mudiay can't shoot, so I'd prefer Okafor.

They can get a PG in free agency.

Vin
01-03-15, 09:30 PM
How's his defense? (I have to ask thanks to what we've seen from Amar'e.)


I never though they'd be leading the NBA in losses at this point, but I'm glad they've taken this route instead of pointless mediocrity.


not the best defender according to this article. but still a very nice read overall.

i'm still going with okafor.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2288751-whos-the-better-prospect-jahlil-okafor-or-karl-anthony-towns

D-Rebounding O-Rebounding Total Rebounding Block Percentage

Okafor 17.22 percent 16.17 percent 16.72 percent 5.4 percent
Towns 25.68 percent 14.49 percent 20.69 percent 17.23 percent

awy
01-04-15, 01:13 AM
offense at 4/5 is overrated. get the higher ceiling guy wth more athleticism and defense

boozer is all world offensively but still a meh player for winning

SLURPEE
01-04-15, 08:54 AM
I believe Towns is more athletic but not as NBA ready as Okafor. Towns also seems to be more active defensively. Doesn't help him that he's on a stacked team. It won't happen but he'd be best served going back to college. imo

Yankyfan
01-05-15, 06:52 PM
Shumpert and Smith traded to Cleveland ??

Vin
01-05-15, 07:09 PM
Whoa.

Knicks trade J.R. Smith, Iman Shumpert to Cavaliers

Read more:

http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2015/1/5/7497113/woj-knicks-dealing-j-r-smith-in-three-team-trade-with-thunder-and

bcom33
01-05-15, 07:28 PM
Ok, first thing's first. I can finally root for this team again.

I said a couple years ago, I couldn't whole-heartedly root for this team again until J.R. was frigging gone. Thank you PHIL JACKSON.

Unfortunately, J.R. is so bad that we had to trade Shumpert just to get rid of him. What a nightmare.

awy
01-05-15, 07:40 PM
what picks are we getting.

Vin
01-05-15, 07:41 PM
I like Shumpert but he seems to be injured a lot.

Good player and he doesn't want to be injured. He can't help it.

Vin
01-05-15, 07:43 PM
what picks are we getting.



Marc Berman @NYPost_Berman
We are hearing Knicks won't be getting any roster players back in this deal. It's all for clearing cap space. JR had opt out.



Steve Popper @StevePopper
Knicks will get lance Thomas, Alex Kirk and Lou Amundsen in the deal - expected to waive all three. Also getting future second rounder.

(5 character limit).

awy
01-05-15, 07:48 PM
hm apparently knicks getting a protected 1st from okc as well. wonder what's the protection on it

Snatch Catch
01-05-15, 08:05 PM
hm apparently knicks getting a protected 1st from okc as well. wonder what's the protection on it

Probably pretty strong.

I'm liking this clearing-of-the-decks approach. Regardless of one's degree of liking/disliking the trade, it says to me that Phil is legitimately in control - and that's refreshing in the midst of a sh*tty season.

THEBOSS84
01-05-15, 08:07 PM
JR Smith is literally my least favorite player in any sport, so this is a huge win no matter what.

kan_t
01-05-15, 08:55 PM
hm apparently knicks getting a protected 1st from okc as well. wonder what's the protection on it
The protected 1st round pick from OKC is sent to the Cavs, not the Knicks.

bcom33
01-05-15, 09:10 PM
The protected 1st round pick from OKC is sent to the Cavs, not the Knicks.

Yeah, we're just getting a 2019 second round pick.

Let's all be honest here. We're literally just trading Shump to dump J.R. We're getting absolutely nothing in return. It's all about getting rid of the disaster that is J.R. Smith before he signs his player option for next year and ruins our lives some more.

TIME TO TANK.

awy
01-05-15, 09:15 PM
such is the badness of jr smith.

but how is cleveland taking those salaries

Yankees1962
01-05-15, 09:15 PM
Yeah, we're just getting a 2019 second round pick.

Let's all be honest here. We're literally just trading Shump to dump J.R. We're getting absolutely nothing in return. It's all about getting rid of the disaster that is J.R. Smith before he signs his player option for next year and ruins our lives some more.

TIME TO TANK.

Shumpert has regressed a lot, particularly, his defense and his offensive game never developed.

kan_t
01-05-15, 09:20 PM
such is the badness of jr smith.

but how is cleveland taking those salaries
The Cavs have trade exception. They probably bank on LBJ to keep JR under control to some extent.


Shumpert has regressed a lot, particularly, his defense and his offensive game never developed.
Not sure if it's the system or his injury. The Knicks give up a lot in order to dump JR. It says a lot about JR.

Yankees1962
01-05-15, 09:26 PM
Not sure if it's the system or his injury. The Knicks give up a lot in order to dump JR. It says a lot about JR.

I'm not so sure as I think Knick fans are thinking Shumpert of today is the same pre-injured Shumpert and he's not. IMO, he's not a good fit for the triangle.

Yankees1962
01-05-15, 09:28 PM
I"m surprise that even after this trade and their expiring contracts next year, the Knicks will only be 30M below the cap in the next offseason. That doesn't sound right to me.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/12125440/jr-smith-dion-waiters-involved-3-team-trade-new-york-knicks-cleveland-cavaliers-oklahoma-city-thunder

kan_t
01-05-15, 09:35 PM
I'm not so sure as I think Knick fans are thinking Shumpert of today is the same pre-injured Shumpert and he's not. IMO, he's not a good fit for the triangle.
He's not a good fit for the triangle. But he should still be valuable chip that the Knicks could get something useful back. Thanks to JR, the Knicks basically get nothing back for Shumpert.

SLURPEE
01-05-15, 09:35 PM
The Cavs have trade exception. They probably bank on LBJ to keep JR under control to some extent.


Not sure if it's the system or his injury. The Knicks give up a lot in order to dump JR. It says a lot about JR.

Not really. Shumpert isn't the same player post knee injury. Besides, he seems to be way into his off the court adventures than he is basketball.

Yankees1962
01-05-15, 09:37 PM
He's not a good fit for the triangle. But he should still be valuable chip that the Knicks could get something useful back. Thanks to JR, the Knicks basically get nothing back for Shumpert.
I don't think so, soon he'll be a free agent. I think his trade value is overvalued.

Snatch Catch
01-05-15, 10:04 PM
Wow. I fully believe that Phil initially tried to build something for this season, but it's pretty awesome that he's switched gears and has embraced the tank. I mean, for God's sake, if it doesn't work this is EXACTLY what you need to do.

Adrian Wojnarowski ✔ @WojYahooNBA
Carmelo Anthony has been resisting idea of resting that sore knee, but Knicks have been encouraging him to sit, league sources tell Yahoo.
6:39 PM - 5 Jan 2015

Panamaniac42
01-05-15, 10:34 PM
Wow. I fully believe that Phil initially tried to build something for this season, but it's pretty awesome that he's switched gears and has embraced the tank. I mean, for God's sake, if it doesn't work this is EXACTLY what you need to do.

Adrian Wojnarowski ✔ @WojYahooNBA
Carmelo Anthony has been resisting idea of resting that sore knee, but Knicks have been encouraging him to sit, league sources tell Yahoo.
6:39 PM - 5 Jan 2015

Beautiful. The only way I could feel more optimistic is if they also still had their 2016 #1 (f*ck you Grunwald).

dabomb2045
01-06-15, 01:19 AM
So nice to see the Knicks FINALLY embracing tanking. For so many years last decade, we refused to do it and kept putting on band aids on gun shot wounds. All it did was ensure us being stuck in purgatory with no hope of getting better. This is what you need to do in the NBA when you are bad. Tank, clear cap space and hope you strike gold with a top draft pick. Okafor or Townes, lets get one of them please.

Jace
01-06-15, 06:36 AM
He's not a good fit for the triangle. But he should still be valuable chip that the Knicks could get something useful back. Thanks to JR, the Knicks basically get nothing back for Shumpert.

He doesn't really have much value... he's completely stagnated since his rookie season (its amazing how identical his numbers are), except in the defensive department, where he's visibly worse. GMs weren't lining up for him.

Sure if they'd have traded him at the peak of his perceived potential they would have done better, but thats like trying to time the stock market with an individual stock. Really hard and mostly luck

THEBOSS84
01-06-15, 09:17 AM
The Calderon contract looks like a terrible decision right now. Could have used that cap space

Panamaniac42
01-06-15, 09:44 AM
The Calderon contract looks like a terrible decision right now. Could have used that cap space

http://www.slamonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/marc_gasol_jose_calderon.jpg

Yankees1962
01-06-15, 10:25 AM
By the way, I don't want Marc Gasol, who turns 30 later this month.

THEBOSS84
01-06-15, 11:11 AM
http://www.slamonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/marc_gasol_jose_calderon.jpg

Ha, you wish he's coming here. Gd bless him if he decides to leave money on the table to come join this mess.

Yankee Tripper
01-06-15, 12:13 PM
By the way, I don't want Marc Gasol, who turns 30 later this month.
Don't worry. I'm sure he'll choose a better landing spot than NYC.

Bascially the Knicks dumped players in a hope of better cap situation to maybe attract some FAs.

But what top FAs are going to want to come to a team lead by an aging ball hogging scorer who doesn't play D and doesn't distribute the ball who may be entering the injury phase of his career and a team that's traded away future 1st round picks after this year?

Yankees1962
01-06-15, 12:47 PM
Don't worry. I'm sure he'll choose a better landing spot than NYC.

Bascially the Knicks dumped players in a hope of better cap situation to maybe attract some FAs.

But what top FAs are going to want to come to a team lead by an aging ball hogging scorer who doesn't play D and doesn't distribute the ball who may be entering the injury phase of his career and a team that's traded away future 1st round picks after this year?
No, they dumped the players because they suck and it was the best move to make at this time.

GordonGecko
01-06-15, 01:32 PM
http://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/intelligencer/2015/01/06/06-iman-shumpert-jr-smith.w529.h352.jpg

Don't worry. I'm sure he'll choose a better landing spot than NYC.

Bascially the Knicks dumped players in a hope of better cap situation to maybe attract some FAs.

But what top FAs are going to want to come to a team lead by an aging ball hogging scorer who doesn't play D and doesn't distribute the ball who may be entering the injury phase of his career and a team that's traded away future 1st round picks after this year?

The guy on 98.7 this weekend was going on about how "people with options don't go somewhere there's chaos". Pretty much true, unless you drown them in cash which is how they got Phil Jackson. Best hope is to trade Melo for picks and an established player they can build around through the draft and then get a free agent in the summer of 2016

Yankee Tripper
01-06-15, 02:17 PM
No, they dumped the players because they suck and it was the best move to make at this time.
Yes and no. Both are role players that can help a team if they need their particular skill set but both have deficiencies that NYK clearly can't cover with their roster.

Yankee Tripper
01-06-15, 02:18 PM
The guy on 98.7 this weekend was going on about how "people with options don't go somewhere there's chaos". Pretty much true, unless you drown them in cash which is how they got Phil Jackson. Best hope is to trade Melo for picks and an established player they can build around through the draft and then get a free agent in the summer of 2016
Pretty much. Phil's gonna have a lot of rebuilding and culture change to do.

THEBOSS84
01-06-15, 02:28 PM
I haven't really considered the idea of trading Melo, but now that I'm thinking about it, I wonder what they could get for him...

I don't think Phil would have any issues with the idea of trading him.

Yankee Tripper
01-06-15, 02:32 PM
I haven't really considered the idea of trading Melo, but now that I'm thinking about it, I wonder what they could get for him...

I don't think Phil would have any issues with the idea of trading him.
With his knee and especially the trade kicker he's very tough to deal with his cap number trying to match up salaries. He also has a NTC but would probably waive for a good situation. Might be easier to deal him in the off season if they go that route.

THEBOSS84
01-06-15, 03:05 PM
With his knee and especially the trade kicker he's very tough to deal with his cap number trying to match up salaries. He also has a NTC but would probably waive for a good situation. Might be easier to deal him in the off season if they go that route.

If the Knicks decide that they basically want to trade him for free (expiring contracts), there will be a market for him. It's just a matter of whether or not they want something in return for him or not.

Yankee Tripper
01-06-15, 03:24 PM
If the Knicks decide that they basically want to trade him for free (expiring contracts), there will be a market for him. It's just a matter of whether or not they want something in return for him or not.
I think you are confusing Melo & A'mare here. They aren't trading Melo for free and Melo's not an expiring contract.

'Mare yeah they may find a salary dump for him somewhere. Doesn't save cap space but it does save real money if they can move him.

edit - oh I see you're saying knicks take on expiring contracts. - still don't see that happening.

THEBOSS84
01-06-15, 04:10 PM
I think you are confusing Melo & A'mare here. They aren't trading Melo for free and Melo's not an expiring contract.

'Mare yeah they may find a salary dump for him somewhere. Doesn't save cap space but it does save real money if they can move him.

edit - oh I see you're saying knicks take on expiring contracts. - still don't see that happening.

You said Melo would be a tough player to trade - I was saying they could trade him depending on what they would want in return for him.

Yankee Tripper
01-06-15, 05:46 PM
You said Melo would be a tough player to trade - I was saying they could trade him depending on what they would want in return for him.
Yeah, hence my edit. My assumption was that they weren't looking to trade a guy they just signed to a near max contract for nothing in return. Despite his selfish play he is one of their few actual assets. The guy still can fill up the whole.

melon
01-06-15, 07:34 PM
Current Knicks team vs Kentucky- who wins?

Vin
01-06-15, 08:24 PM
Would like to see Melo traded eventually.

Edit: Although this article is making me rethink that statement :bad:

link: The Five Toughest Players I’ve Ever Guarded (http://www.theplayerstribune.com/paul-pierce-five-toughest-players-ive-ever-guarded)



Kobe is one of the best scorers in NBA history, but I don’t have as much trouble with him in the post as I do with Carmelo. LeBron is a great post-up player, but if you get him to settle for the jumper on some nights, you might be able to slow him down if his shot is off. That’s not the case with Melo. If you give him space to shoot, he’ll make it many more times than he misses it.

To put it plainly, he’s not a fun assignment on defense.

Jace
01-07-15, 08:20 AM
Yes and no. Both are role players that can help a team if they need their particular skill set but both have deficiencies that NYK clearly can't cover with their roster.

I completely disagree about JR, and somewhat disagree about Shumpert. JR has been among the worst regulars in the entire league this year just off straight numbers, and he was close to that last year as well. He's never been even an average defender. We saw his upside in 2012-13 (that he's extremely unlikely to hit again) - he needs a perfect situation where the team plays exactly his style of ball, and he'll still implode as soon as games get tight. He singlehandedly sunk that team in the playoffs after getting them to depend on him during the regular season

Right now JR is a role player that hurts a team, literally. We've all watched lineups where he thinks he's the primary scorer, where any team concepts cease to exist. Lebron seems as good a candidate to get JR back to useful 6th man form as anyone... but we'll see.

Shumpert is still a gambler on defense, but gets blown by enough times now (maybe lost lateral quickness from the ACL tear) that the gambles are a negative. He's a terrible offensive player outside of spot-up shooting, the only part of his game that has developed at all. He's lost and passive the majority of the time, easy to tell just from the box scores of him playing 30 minutes with 6 points on 7 shots and 2 assists.

I could see him picking up his defense again on the right team, but the Knicks have waited for him to match his athletic potential on offense, giving him many chances in lineups with Carmelo, and it hasn't happened

Yankee Tripper
01-07-15, 11:31 AM
The deadspin article is hilarious. Well more sad than hilarious if your a knick fan but still if you can handle the f-bombs ... http://deadspin.com/how-in-the-ever-lovin-hell-can-the-knicks-be-so-much-bu-1677679428

Yankee Tripper
01-07-15, 11:35 AM
I completely disagree about JR, and somewhat disagree about Shumpert. JR has been among the worst regulars in the entire league this year just off straight numbers, and he was close to that last year as well. He's never been even an average defender. We saw his upside in 2012-13 (that he's extremely unlikely to hit again) - he needs a perfect situation where the team plays exactly his style of ball, and he'll still implode as soon as games get tight. He singlehandedly sunk that team in the playoffs after getting them to depend on him during the regular season

Right now JR is a role player that hurts a team, literally. We've all watched lineups where he thinks he's the primary scorer, where any team concepts cease to exist. Lebron seems as good a candidate to get JR back to useful 6th man form as anyone... but we'll see.

Shumpert is still a gambler on defense, but gets blown by enough times now (maybe lost lateral quickness from the ACL tear) that the gambles are a negative. He's a terrible offensive player outside of spot-up shooting, the only part of his game that has developed at all. He's lost and passive the majority of the time, easy to tell just from the box scores of him playing 30 minutes with 6 points on 7 shots and 2 assists.

I could see him picking up his defense again on the right team, but the Knicks have waited for him to match his athletic potential on offense, giving him many chances in lineups with Carmelo, and it hasn't happened
I get what your saying and JR may prove to be the same cancer in Cleveland but as 6th man scorer on the 2nd unit I think JR can be more than useful. As a starting wing, I agree he kind of does suck and if your asking him to be the #2 scoring option in crunch time like the knicks did, good luck with that.

Cleveland doesn't need Shumpert to score they've got plenty who can carry that load. They need him to be a good wing defender which he certainly has the capability of doing.

SLURPEE
01-07-15, 12:33 PM
Phil should be executive of the year if he can make this happen. (no shot, I know)

Gasol
Okafor
Anthony
Leonard
Dragic

OR

Okafor
Anthony
Leonard
Whoever
Dragic

Panamaniac42
01-07-15, 12:43 PM
Shumpert is still a gambler on defense, but gets blown by enough times now (maybe lost lateral quickness from the ACL tear) that the gambles are a negative.


Just one example, but I think back to the game against the Nets where he got absolutely shredded by Deron Williams. He knew stopping Deron was critical and it was all on his shoulders, and couldn't do a damn thing about it. Just got lit up and let him penetrate at will. Unfortunately, he's far from the defender we saw in his rookie season (he was awesome).

Panamaniac42
01-07-15, 12:45 PM
Phil should be executive of the year if he can make this happen. (no shot, I know)

Gasol
Okafor
Anthony
Leonard
Dragic

OR

Okafor
Anthony
Leonard
Whoever
Dragic

What does everybody think about Greg Monroe?

Yankees1962
01-08-15, 08:07 AM
What does everybody think about Greg Monroe?
If they get Okafor then Monroe can become a good option at PF with Melo at SF. Monroe doesn't turn 25 until June of this year.

Snatch Catch
01-08-15, 09:19 AM
I'm not saying I'm opposed to it, but it's worth noting that a frontline of Okafor/Monroe/Melo would be elite-level terrible defensively.

Panamaniac42
01-08-15, 10:21 AM
I'm not saying I'm opposed to it, but it's worth noting that a frontline of Okafor/Monroe/Melo would be elite-level terrible defensively.

True, true. Too bad we don't still have Mozgov. From Melo throw-in to fetching two first-rounders. :(

THEBOSS84
01-08-15, 11:01 AM
As Knick fans, we'd be dumb to even pencil in Okafor. You just know they aren't getting the first overall pick. They'll probably end up with #3-4.

awy
01-08-15, 04:07 PM
draft towns at 1

Sixty one
01-09-15, 08:52 PM
It's a mystery to me how fans continue to pay big bucks to see this team play. It's hard to accept how in this year the Knicks continue to look like a pick up team in a recreation league. Dolan and Jackson should be giving back money to their fans.:mad::mad:

Yankyfan
01-09-15, 10:31 PM
Roy Tarpley dead at 50.What could have been..SAD.

Mr. Mxylsplk
01-15-15, 02:25 PM
There was a time when an afternoon game would have had me surreptitiously streaming the game at work. Those days are gone. (I have been peeking at the score though - falling behind 14-0 to open the game? Well done NYK).

SLURPEE
01-15-15, 02:54 PM
Looking at the history of the lottery, Cleveland & Orlando have been the luckiest teams. Also, mostly the 3rd worst record/s have won it.

melon
01-15-15, 03:54 PM
Since the season is about getting a high draft pick....keep your eye on Freshman swingman Stanley Johnson of Arizona. The guy is a beast and is built for football.

He'd look great in a Knicks uniform and should be available in the top 5.

Yankees1962
01-15-15, 06:17 PM
5-36 record at mid-point of their 2014-2015 season.

THEBOSS84
01-15-15, 06:24 PM
5-36 record at mid-point of their 2014-2015 season.

I'm actually happy about their record. They're no longer average.

dabomb2045
01-15-15, 08:29 PM
This team is probably gonna end up as one of the worst 2 or 3 single season teams in the history of the NBA. I dont see them getting to 10 wins. I dont even know if they will win another game.

GordonGecko
01-15-15, 08:33 PM
I dont see them getting to 10 wins. I dont even know if they will win another game.

http://www.gocurrycracker.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/cm-23138-050624abe3a9e6.jpeg

SLURPEE
01-16-15, 08:58 AM
This team is probably gonna end up as one of the worst 2 or 3 single season teams in the history of the NBA. I dont see them getting to 10 wins. I dont even know if they will win another game.

Only teams on their level are 76'ers and T-Wolves. Next win could be Wednesday vs Philly.

I thought they would win 18-25, because I assumed there would be more hideous teams. Magic, Bucks, Lakers, Hornets, Pacers, Celtics, Pistons and Jazz are surprisingly, all better than the Knicks.

Panamaniac42
01-16-15, 09:19 AM
Only teams on their level are 76'ers and T-Wolves.

Hopefully the returns of Rubio & Martin have a nice impact for the T-Wolves.

awy
01-19-15, 12:19 AM
increasingly convinced that karl anthony towns is the right pick for the knicks and with the okafor hype recently there's a decent chance a knicks team that is zoomed in on towns could get him at a top 3 pick position rather than having to win the top pick.

really think okafor's lack of lateral quickness will limit his role and within this role he won't be as dominant in the pros as he is in college.

kan_t
01-19-15, 12:50 AM
http://www.gocurrycracker.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/cm-23138-050624abe3a9e6.jpeg
As long as they're in the lottery pool, it really doesn't matter what their record is if you aim at No.1 pick. It's crapshot.

SLURPEE
01-19-15, 08:02 AM
increasingly convinced that karl anthony towns is the right pick for the knicks and with the okafor hype recently there's a decent chance a knicks team that is zoomed in on towns could get him at a top 3 pick position rather than having to win the top pick.

really think okafor's lack of lateral quickness will limit his role and within this role he won't be as dominant in the pros as he is in college.

I like the fact that Towns brings it on defense. Which is always a positive with young players. You just never know will they improve. But my thing is, if they're not getting it done in college, why would they in the pros?
Okafor for his size should be averaging double figure rebounds.

I do think if Okafor ever developed a jumpshot, will be the better NBA player. But Towns will always be the better overall player.

Comes down to, do you want the great offensive player with spotty defense OR the player that's good all around but doesn't dominant one area.

awy
01-19-15, 08:19 AM
okafor is shooting like 65% free throw not seeing the range potential.

Vin
01-19-15, 02:23 PM
If this was baseball, I'd pick the better offensive player with spotty defense.

But now that I read more about Towns, I think he'd be a nicer fit because of his defense that complements his offense; which hopefully would rub off on his teammates.

bcom33
01-19-15, 03:21 PM
I like the fact that Towns brings it on defense. Which is always a positive with young players. You just never know will they improve. But my thing is, if they're not getting it done in college, why would they in the pros?
Okafor for his size should be averaging double figure rebounds.

I do think if Okafor ever developed a jumpshot, will be the better NBA player. But Towns will always be the better overall player.

Comes down to, do you want the great offensive player with spotty defense OR the player that's good all around but doesn't dominant one area.

If that's what it comes down to, I'd take Okafor every single time.

I don't understand why anyone's not talking about Myles Turner if they're interested in Towns. Turner's an even better defender, with better range, and 88% free throw shooting.

But, Okafor is obviously the star here. He's shooting 68% from the field and has been going 23/10 regularly over the past several games. Towns and Turner are scoring like 3-4 baskets a game. They're projects who might pan out on defense, but will be soft guys who shoot too many mid-range jump shots and miss them.

I'd 10/10 times take the SURE offensive threat with potential to play better defense in the future. Especially Okafor who will compliment Melo by staying out of his friggin way, and not clogging up the mid-range shots Melo wants.

If we can't get the number 1 pick, we almost certainly miss out on Okafor, and then my highest priority would be Mudiay. There are a bunch of Centers available in free agency anyway, so if you don't get a star in the draft, I'd try to sign someone like DeAndre Jordan. Stanley Johnson would be someone to consider as well, or D'Angelo Russell.

Vin
01-19-15, 04:37 PM
http://www.draftexpress.com/article/2014-FIBA-U18-Americas-Championship-US-Scouting-Reports-4634/



Myles Turner, 6'11, Center, USA

Incoming Freshman (Texas), RSCI #5


Strengths
-Excellent size, frame and length for a center.
-Great instincts as a shot blocker. Rotates well. Alters shots. Very good timing.
-Good offensive rebounder.
-Very good shooting touch. Capable out to 3-point range. Comfortable in mid-range spots.
-Upside offensively. Can get to a turnaround jumper comfortably. Fundamentally sound rip-through from 17 feet. Pretty good touch on right handed jump hook.
-High IQ. Good passer. Knows where to be on the defensive end.
-Good hands.
-Plays with great effort. Works hard on the glass.

Weaknesses
-Lacks mobility. Struggles getting up and down with fluidity. Runs awkwardly.
-Huge feet slow him down. Has issues hedging and recovering.
-Average body.
-Lacks explosiveness. Not an above the rim guy.
-Not comfortable turning over his right shoulder.
-Lacks go-to moves on the block. Doesn't get deep position.
-Foul prone.

melon
01-19-15, 07:21 PM
We finally won. I'm kinda hoping this doesn't jump start a win streak.....

awy
01-19-15, 07:27 PM
clogging up midrange shots? first time ive heard about that. melo is a post mismatch player and okafor will clog up the post and do nothing to help spacing. post offense is okay as an available option but it's not the optimal strategy for building an offense, unless you have a shaq or something and okafor is far from shaq.

let me put it this way, for the next couple years at least, melo's post game is far better than okafor's at the nba level. if you put melo in college right now with a bad knee and all he'll still dominate the kids in the post no questions asked. in the future okafor may be better in the post, but you need to be a historically great post player to be a great impact player if you are limited to that space.

his shooting % is what it is in college, with a system designed to give him iso against college bigs who are far from nba quality post defenders. if we look at shooting efficiency numbers, the guy who takes 100% of his shot near the basket will obviously have a higher percentage, but this does not mean this will happen on every possession. it is pretty easy to defend against a relatively immobile big man without an elite pass game. okafor is not the better offensive player if we take into account the modern nba team level game.


towns is more athletic and shows a greater variety of skills. his per-possession efficiency is excellent and he is being used as a spacing big by kentucky alongside WCS. he doesn't need to score for himself to help the offense, just drawing out the post defender to midrange and moving the ball is enough.

his athleticism and projected physical growth is what sets his ceiling higher than okafor, and people are looking at his per game numbers and assuming he is raw. he's actually pretty skilled, and a good passer for his position.



another good thing about towns is his makeup, both in terms of personality/intellectual ability and team culture building. he is not complaining about his touches in kentucky, instead playing away from the basket and is content being a defense guy and taking his scoring opportunities within the flow of the offense. they do nto run plays for him, and the kentucky guards are really selfish players. towns will be a good piece to build the future of this team around because he's a hardcore knicks fan and wants to win.



knicks fans should watch kentucky games and check out this towns kid. he'll be good.

awy
01-19-15, 07:33 PM
http://www.draftexpress.com/article/2014-FIBA-U18-Americas-Championship-US-Scouting-Reports-4634/

immobile bigs are really vulnerable in the modern nba game. it's the pick and rolls

SLURPEE
01-19-15, 08:10 PM
We finally won. I'm kinda hoping this doesn't jump start a win streak.....

I wouldn't worry. Davis was missing and they still almost blew the game, with Melo and Amar'e playing. lol

dabomb2045
01-19-15, 10:39 PM
I wouldn't worry. Davis was missing and they still almost blew the game, with Melo and Amar'e playing. lol

They also didnt have Jrue Holiday

Mr. Mxylsplk
01-21-15, 11:17 AM
I'm kind of feeling a 1-13 stretch coming up.

1-1
2-4
3-9
4-16
5-25
6-36

The Knicks' square root record run cannot be stopped.

Panamaniac42
01-21-15, 01:18 PM
(lots of good points)

knicks fans should watch kentucky games and check out this towns kid. he'll be good.

I've had a thing for Towns since I was following him in H.S. praying for a miracle scenario where he'd commit to Rutgers (lol).

In addition to everything you've said, I liked the way he handled himself a few years ago at FIBA -- at the age of 17 -- vs. guys like A. Davis. I also dig the 'local kid' angle and am underwhelmed by the lottery picks that have come out of Duke (not that that's the most rational argument against Okafor).

I dunno, I'd be content with either but prefer Towns, who I think is the more well-rounded prospect.

Panamaniac42
01-21-15, 01:20 PM
We finally won. I'm kinda hoping this doesn't jump start a win streak.....


Philly tonight...clash of the titans. Hopefully MCW goes off and leads them to victory.

dabomb2045
01-21-15, 09:12 PM
Stop winning games!

Vin
01-21-15, 09:48 PM
yea...wtf

Panamaniac42
01-21-15, 11:41 PM
Langston Galloway is destroying our season.

melon
01-21-15, 11:42 PM
Yep, we're embarking on a winning streak....

Vin
01-21-15, 11:53 PM
Langston Galloway is destroying our season.

:lol:


That circus shot was Carmelo-esque.

Yankees1962
01-22-15, 05:46 AM
Yep, we're embarking on a winning streak....
Just consider the two teams they just played, one was without their two best players and the other is as terrible as the Knicks.

Panamaniac42
01-22-15, 09:26 AM
Good thing lottery reform was voted down in October...

https://cdn3.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/_dGs9GrR3sF1KuXQFJ1agedRKw8=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/3320704/lotto-reform.0.png

kan_t
01-22-15, 10:13 PM
How many worst record team got the No.1 pick in last ten years?

THEBOSS84
01-22-15, 10:18 PM
How many worst record team got the No.1 pick in last ten years?

Zero - Orlando with D-Howard in 2004 was the last team

Panamaniac42
01-23-15, 01:36 PM
Zero - Orlando with D-Howard in 2004 was the last team

Yep. For anyone interested here's a link with past odds and lottery results. Still shaking my head at Cleveland taking the top slot last year with a 1.7% chance.

http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/lottery_results/2014


I beat this horse to death, but anytime I see the 2006 and 2007 drafts where NY's picks were used on LaMarcus Aldridge & Joakim Noah, I feel sick to my stomach.

Yankee Tripper
01-23-15, 02:21 PM
Yep. For anyone interested here's a link with past odds and lottery results. Still shaking my head at Cleveland taking the top slot last year with a 1.7% chance.

http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/lottery_results/2014


I beat this horse to death, but anytime I see the 2006 and 2007 drafts where NY's picks were used on LaMarcus Aldridge & Joakim Noah, I feel sick to my stomach.
I think you are forgetting Isiah Thomas was GM then so those picks probably would have been used on Adam Morrison and Julian Wright so stop beating yourself up.

SLURPEE
01-23-15, 03:44 PM
Yep. For anyone interested here's a link with past odds and lottery results. Still shaking my head at Cleveland taking the top slot last year with a 1.7% chance.

http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/lottery_results/2014


I beat this horse to death, but anytime I see the 2006 and 2007 drafts where NY's picks were used on LaMarcus Aldridge & Joakim Noah, I feel sick to my stomach.

How about the Bulls getting Rose with same percentage. If that was the Knicks people would have been calling it rigged.

melon
01-23-15, 04:48 PM
I think you are forgetting Isiah Thomas was GM then so those picks probably would have been used on Adam Morrison and Julian Wright so stop beating yourself up.

Thank you for that perspective. I feel better now.

At least we eventually ended up with the top pick in the draft....sounds better on paper than in reality. Man, that was a weak class.

Panamaniac42
01-23-15, 05:53 PM
I think you are forgetting Isiah Thomas was GM then so those picks probably would have been used on Adam Morrison and Julian Wright so stop beating yourself up.


Ha, well Isiah is a racist, so maybe it would have been Tyrus Thomas instead of Morrison. :)

awy
01-23-15, 06:39 PM
i feel the knicks will be better off with picking towns so they don't really need the #1 pick.

melon
01-23-15, 06:49 PM
Ha, well Isiah is a racist, so maybe it would have been Tyrus Thomas instead of Morrison. :)

Yeah, I was thinking how ironic it would have been for him to draft the next Larry Bird...

Vin
01-23-15, 07:33 PM
What does everyone think of D'Angelo Russell? read some nice things about him.

At least if Okafor and Towns is off the table.

awy
01-23-15, 09:22 PM
lol come on stop winning

Snatch Catch
01-23-15, 09:33 PM
What does everyone think of D'Angelo Russell? read some nice things about him.

At least if Okafor and Towns is off the table.

Russell is really, really nice. I like him a lot. No problems at this point if he ends up being our guy.

And enough is enough with these wins. You got your little confidence boost, rallied as a team, bonded with Fisher. Now stop.

dabomb2045
01-24-15, 01:20 AM
Langston Galloway is ruining the season. Also Melo...stop playing and sit on the bench.

SLURPEE
01-24-15, 07:30 AM
They're winning. :(

melon
01-24-15, 01:05 PM
Good thing lottery reform was voted down in October...


You think some Knicks fans get nervous when the team wins this year?

It's much worse in Lakerland. Lakers get to keep their first rounder only if it's in the top 5. Otherwise, they lose it due to the fantastic Steve Nash trade...

Laker fans are probably happier than anyone that the lottery reform was voted down as it would have really impacted their chances for a top 5 pick.

SLURPEE
01-25-15, 01:43 PM
What does everyone think of D'Angelo Russell? read some nice things about him.

At least if Okafor and Towns is off the table.

Looks good. Watching him for the first time today. Has everything you look for in a PG. His weaknesses in the scouting reports don't scare me. Consistency. Which is the case for all young players. I haven't seen Mudiay outside of highlights but he can't shoot and you don't know whether he will develop a J.

If they can't get Okafor, Russell or Towns are my picks.

bcom33
01-25-15, 02:42 PM
Okafor is getting completely exposed by St. John's. I've never seen him play this badly, but he looks completely immobile and is constantly letting himself get pushed out of the paint by smaller guys.

Definitely making me rethink my stance on wanting him 1st overall.

GordonGecko
01-28-15, 12:17 PM
hahaha

http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/tix/4867145042.html


Additional bonus perks:

1. Getting to watch Carmelo hold the ball and slow down the already slowest offense in the league before he eventually hoists up a horrendous shot that does not go in.
2. Watching him complain in an uproar why a foul wasn't called even though it was probably a wide open, ill-advised three point attempt.
3. Watching Derek Fisher throw a temper tantrum because the refs ignore him calling timeouts.
4. Watching the team implode and fight with each other as has already been reported, only up close and in person.
5. Hearing Mike Breen (nearby and on the tvs right in front) talk about the good things the Knicks did and how close they are to turning it around, while simultaneously waxing poetic about how amazing the refs are.

Vin
01-28-15, 06:10 PM
Hah.

So I read Prigioni's the next to be traded.

dabomb2045
01-28-15, 09:14 PM
WTF is this team doing? STOP WINNING. Sit Melo.

Vin
01-28-15, 09:49 PM
My thoughts as well. They need to "rest" his knees.

And stop pretending you're a real basketball team.

Snatch Catch
01-28-15, 10:10 PM
WTF is this team doing? STOP WINNING. Sit Melo.

I'd like them to keep losing, too, but the reality is that they weren't THIS bad (i.e. worst record in the league) and even if they were the odds of them getting the #1 overall pick were still improbable.

awy
01-28-15, 10:20 PM
i dont really care if they get the #1 pick. this winning is building some good chemistry.

problem is when they play well like this going forward. then that becomes a problem.

dabomb2045
01-28-15, 11:23 PM
What chemistry are you building? Other then Melo and maybe Galloway there is nobody on this roster that will be a part of the long term solution for this team.

Melo should be sitting. He is playing with a knee thats less then 100% and has said he will probably need surgery on it. Its reckless to be playing him in games that dont matter.

awy
01-28-15, 11:29 PM
an organizational culture.

dabomb2045
01-28-15, 11:40 PM
They can start doing that next year when they have a healthy Melo (hopefully), Galloway, hopefully Okafor/Townes/Mudiay, and some FA signings.

bcom33
01-28-15, 11:55 PM
Ok, so I've come 180 on Okafor, and am willing to admit I was wrong. His defense is atrocious. He has been been destroyed on the defensive end of the floor the past few games. He's still putting up great rebounding numbers and scoring in creative ways against smaller players on the other end, but he is a complete zero on defense.

Now, I'm firmly in the camp of D'Angelo Russell being the number 1 pick. A left handed point guard with size (6'5") shooting 45 % from 3, who is athletic and can pass. He's basically putting up 20/5/5 lines every game now. Mudiay is a complete unknown at this point, and he can't shoot. Towns is a project, who may end up being more valuable than Okafor, but no one really knows. I think Russell is now the best option...if we stop winning and get a top 3 pick.

awy
01-29-15, 12:00 AM
dont have a problme with angelo russell. towns is a nice kid though

SLURPEE
01-29-15, 08:18 AM
What chemistry are you building? Other then Melo and maybe Galloway there is nobody on this roster that will be a part of the long term solution for this team.

Melo should be sitting. He is playing with a knee thats less then 100% and has said he will probably need surgery on it. Its reckless to be playing him in games that dont matter.

All Star Game....


Ok, so I've come 180 on Okafor, and am willing to admit I was wrong. His defense is atrocious. He has been been destroyed on the defensive end of the floor the past few games. He's still putting up great rebounding numbers and scoring in creative ways against smaller players on the other end, but he is a complete zero on defense.

Now, I'm firmly in the camp of D'Angelo Russell being the number 1 pick. A left handed point guard with size (6'5") shooting 45 % from 3, who is athletic and can pass. He's basically putting up 20/5/5 lines every game now. Mudiay is a complete unknown at this point, and he can't shoot. Towns is a project, who may end up being more valuable than Okafor, but no one really knows. I think Russell is now the best option...if we stop winning and get a top 3 pick.

I've soured on Okafor myself. Terrific post game but is lacking in other parts of his game.

Russell or Towns would be my pick.

bcom33
01-29-15, 05:06 PM
D'Angelo Russell is gonna be playing in a hour (7 EDT on ESPN) against Maryland. Probably their toughest matchup of the season so far. Probably the toughest game they'll play all year, until Wisconsin in March.

Just in case you wanna scout him along with me.

Edit: 1st half update. Russell made about 6 fantastic passes in the first 8 minutes of the game. He's playing extremely smart, and setting up his teammates while Maryland flocks to him on defense. Especially in transition, his passing has been spectacular. Later in the half, he got his 3-point shot going. He's all over the court making great plays, and using his length on defense, and boxing out taller players. He's so freaking good. He's forced a few questionable contested jump shots, but I can't blame him too much because both teams are struggling to score.

Finishes the 1st half with 12 points, 7 rebounds, and 5 assists. He could easily have 8 assists if his teammates hadn't missed some easy shots. Completely controlling the game.

awy
01-29-15, 07:18 PM
yea this guy is super legit. how is he looking on defense

bcom33
01-29-15, 07:41 PM
yea this guy is super legit. how is he looking on defense

He's looking pretty good in general. He's shown some good instincts jumping into passing lanes for steals, or to break up plays. He has long arms, so he's been able to grab defensive rebounds as well. Good lateral quickness. Can stay in front of guys. Has been hounding his man pretty well, and has been good running around screens.

No major weaknesses that I've seen so far.

Lol, and now he banked in a three from the top of the arc, just because he can.

Edit: Actually, it's not just his long arms leading to defensive rebounds. It's just excellent positioning and anticipation in general. He now has 13 rebounds.

SLURPEE
01-29-15, 07:49 PM
Russell is legit. Forget Mudiay.

Like I said, it's either Towns or Russell if I'm Phil.

bcom33
01-29-15, 07:49 PM
Russell is legit. Forget Mudiay.

Like I said, it's either Towns or Russell if I'm Phil.

Lucky for us Kentucky is on next, haha. Good chance to see how Towns is doing.

bcom33
01-29-15, 07:55 PM
Ohio St. pulls Russell out of the game with 2 minutes to go. He's done his job. 18 points, 14 rebounds, 6 assists, 0 turnovers, 2 steals.

Absolutely freaking ridiculous. I think my favorite thing about him is his quick, high release on his shot. Perfect for the NBA. Also, great shooting touch leading to several offensive rebound chances on misses.

Vin
01-29-15, 08:19 PM
Thanks for the play by play bcom33. He sounds downright legit.

bcom33
01-29-15, 08:22 PM
Thanks for the play by play bcom33. He sounds downright legit.

No problem. It was really, really fun to watch him play.

Towns playing now. Has missed a mid-range jumper and several post-moves so far. Had one nice right-handed baby hook for a basket.

On defense, no one wants to go near him, and anyone who does has been challenged and failed so far.

Edit: Man, Calipari's full-team platoon substitutions are extremely obnoxious. Barely been able to see Towns. He's been a non-factor on offense, since early in the game. Still playing solid on D.

At the end of the 1st half, Towns shot 3/7 from the field, 6 points, 1 rebound. A few decent post moves through the half. Looks raw though. Miles away from Okafor in terms of post play. Calipari says he thinks Towns is playing well, "the best he's played in the post this season". Well, that's concerning, lol.

Man. This is an ugly game. I can understand why people have Towns ahead of Cauley-Stein. WCS is atrocious. He's completely lost. Just an extremely dumb player. Towns is not THAT far ahead of him though. Seems like all athleticism to me. Hasn't shown any offensive move besides a right spinning baby hook.

Towns fouls out with 2 minutes left in the game. 7 points, 2 rebounds. Thoroughly unimpressive.

awy
01-29-15, 10:20 PM
with KD's 2016 FA i think knicks should tailor the roster around that potential team. russell seems like a really nice piece to fit into this kind of team, but towns' defensive presence could work wonders as well. a KD team with good spacing will be sick

bcom33
01-29-15, 10:45 PM
with KD's 2016 FA i think knicks should tailor the roster around that potential team. russell seems like a really nice piece to fit into this kind of team, but towns' defensive presence could work wonders as well. a KD team with good spacing will be sick

Yeah, I think it just makes sense to draft a really good guard if they can, since there are so many free agent centers. If Okafor somehow shows increased athleticism over the course of the season, he might still be above Towns for me. Russell has a string of not so great teams in front of him. Won't see him challenged again until Wisconsin in the last game of the season, and then the tourney. Okafor will have a lot more chances to prove his worth, or not.

Because there will be so much competition in the free agent market this offseason with so many productive centers available, it's possible we might be able to sign a guy significantly under the max. There are basically no point guards to consider beyond Dragic and Reggie Jackson.

I'd love to draft Russell, sign Wes Matthews and DeAndre Jordan for example. I doubt that leaves enough room under the cap to sign Durant the year after, but moves could be made to open up space. I think Durant would consider us more of a possibility if we actually win some games next year. I would absolutely not plan around the possibility of him coming here. We tried that with LeBron and it wrecked us.

melon
02-02-15, 12:36 AM
Knicks winning 5 of last 7....

:dunno:

SLURPEE
02-02-15, 11:19 AM
Knicks winning 5 of last 7....

:dunno:

Easy schedule and Melo playing.

awy
02-03-15, 08:09 PM
KAT with a good game.

bcom33
02-03-15, 09:04 PM
KAT with a good game.

Yeah, that's a pretty impressive line, and he actually got some minutes this game.

31 mins, 15 pts on 6-11 shooting, 2 blocks 13 rebounds.

Of course, there's something to be said about the fact that Georgia only has one 6'10" player, and he played 3 minutes. All of their other forwards are 6'8". So Cauley-Stein and KAT tower over them. Probably helped out, a lot.