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TheInfallibleOne
06-09-10, 10:30 AM
Didn't see this anywhere, and its probably about time to get the rumor mill and subsequent discussion going.

I'll start:

What is all this crap I hear about Nunez and Romine/Montero to the Mariners for Lee? In what world would Cashman bid against himself like this for a rental when he can keep the prospects and get Lee in FA?

EDIT: LINK (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/rumors/post/Mariners-want-Lee-trade-with-Yankees?urn=mlb,246833)

wang+cano=future
06-09-10, 10:36 AM
Maybe in Seattle's dream world...........

R.V.47
06-09-10, 10:38 AM
Link? I havent heard anything about any interest in Lee. Why would the yankees deal for Lee when they currently have 5 very good starters all pitching well?

Yankee Fan in Boston
06-09-10, 10:44 AM
I posted this somewhere else this morning. It seems very one-sided (Seattle's interest). They clearly don't pay attention to Cashman's tendencies (not trading premium prospects for guys who are determined to walk) or our needs.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/rumors/post/Mariners-want-Lee-trade-with-Yankees?urn=mlb,246833

wang+cano=future
06-09-10, 10:44 AM
Link? I havent heard anything about any interest in Lee. Why would the yankees deal for Lee when they currently have 5 very good starters all pitching well?

King said it this morning:

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yankees/expect_yanks_to_make_cliff_bid_pKw2dvYWZbB9nA0OjQAm2K

Bleacher_Creature
06-09-10, 10:45 AM
Mariners Expect Yankees To Pursue Cliff Lee (http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/06/mariners-expect-yankees-to-pursue-cliff-lee.html)

By Tim Dierkes [June 9, 2010 at 8:03am CST]

The Mariners are preparing for the Yankees to pursue ace lefty Cliff Lee (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/l/leecl02.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), reports George A. King III of the New York Post (http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yankees/expect_yanks_to_make_cliff_bid_pKw2dvYWZbB9nA0OjQAm2K). King says the Mariners have already scouted the Yankees' Low A and Double A clubs and aim to watch their Triple A squad soon. King spoke to a "person familiar with Seattle's thought process" who believes Jack Zduriencik will seek Triple A shortstop Eduardo Nunez (http://www.baseball-reference.com/player_search.cgi?search=Eduardo+Nunez&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker) as well as one of the Yankees' minor league catchers. King suggests that the Yankees would need assurances that they could sign Lee to an extension if they're required to surrender Austin Romine (http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker&id=romine001aus) or Jesus Montero (http://www.baseball-reference.com/player_search.cgi?search=Jesus+Montero&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker).

King believes renting Lee would hold appeal to the Yankees despite their strong rotation. The Yanks' boast a front five of C.C. Sabathia (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/sabatc.01.shtml), A.J. Burnett (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/burnea.01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), Andy Pettitte (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pettian01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), Phil Hughes (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/hugheph01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), and Javier Vazquez (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/v/vazquja01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), and it's not clear who they'd bump for Lee. The most likely candidate, Vazquez, has a 2.73 ERA in 33 innings since returning from a break on May 12th. Trading Vazquez to clear a spot for Lee seems a convoluted to me.

With Nick Johnson (http://www.baseball-reference.com/player_search.cgi?search=Nick+Johnson&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker) potentially out for the season, an offensive addition would be more fitting. To that end, King says the Yankees have scouts following the Astros in case Lance Berkman (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/berkmla01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker) becomes available. Berkman is still owed $11.2MM heading into today's action, however.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/06/mariners-expect-yankees-to-pursue-cliff-lee.html

AnA-bombforA-rod
06-09-10, 10:47 AM
No way I am giving up Montero or Romine, but if the Mariners wanted Murphy or Sanchez, I'd probably make that trade.

wang+cano=future
06-09-10, 10:52 AM
No way I am giving up Montero or Romine, but if the Mariners wanted Murphy or Sanchez, I'd probably make that trade.

Ehh I would hesitate even on those guys, especially on Sanchez. The Yankee rotation has been solid all year, even with Vazquez starting out horribly. But now he is pitching better and there isn't a need to go and trade one of our young catchers when Lee can be had in free agency.

Yankee Fan in Boston
06-09-10, 10:52 AM
No way I am giving up Montero or Romine, but if the Mariners wanted Murphy or Sanchez, I'd probably make that trade.

I'd think they'd get more someplace else. I really don't see us in on this guy,

AnA-bombforA-rod
06-09-10, 10:57 AM
Ehh I would hesitate even on those guys, especially on Sanchez. The Yankee rotation has been solid all year, even with Vazquez starting out horribly. But now he is pitching better and there isn't a need to go and trade one of our young catchers when Lee can be had in free agency.

I guess, but if you can get him and sign him to an extension, and only have to give up Murphy or Sanchez plus Nunez that's something to look into IMO. But like Yankee Fan In Boston said, they could probably get more than Murphy or Sanchez anyway, so it may be a moot point.

wang+cano=future
06-09-10, 10:59 AM
I guess, but if you can get him and sign him to an extension, and only have to give up Murphy or Sanchez plus Nunez that's something to look into IMO. But like Yankee Fan In Boston said, they could probably get more than Murphy or Sanchez anyway, so it may be a moot point.

Yeah I agree the Mariners could get more from another team. Plus Lee has already stated he will test the free agency market, so signing him to an extension may not be possible.

R.V.47
06-09-10, 10:59 AM
Mariners Expect Yankees To Pursue Cliff Lee (http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/06/mariners-expect-yankees-to-pursue-cliff-lee.html)

By Tim Dierkes [June 9, 2010 at 8:03am CST]

The Mariners are preparing for the Yankees to pursue ace lefty Cliff Lee (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/l/leecl02.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), reports George A. King III of the New York Post (http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yankees/expect_yanks_to_make_cliff_bid_pKw2dvYWZbB9nA0OjQAm2K). King says the Mariners have already scouted the Yankees' Low A and Double A clubs and aim to watch their Triple A squad soon. King spoke to a "person familiar with Seattle's thought process" who believes Jack Zduriencik will seek Triple A shortstop Eduardo Nunez (http://www.baseball-reference.com/player_search.cgi?search=Eduardo+Nunez&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker) as well as one of the Yankees' minor league catchers. King suggests that the Yankees would need assurances that they could sign Lee to an extension if they're required to surrender Austin Romine (http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker&id=romine001aus) or Jesus Montero (http://www.baseball-reference.com/player_search.cgi?search=Jesus+Montero&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker).

King believes renting Lee would hold appeal to the Yankees despite their strong rotation. The Yanks' boast a front five of C.C. Sabathia (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/sabatc.01.shtml), A.J. Burnett (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/burnea.01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), Andy Pettitte (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pettian01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), Phil Hughes (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/hugheph01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), and Javier Vazquez (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/v/vazquja01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker), and it's not clear who they'd bump for Lee. The most likely candidate, Vazquez, has a 2.73 ERA in 33 innings since returning from a break on May 12th. Trading Vazquez to clear a spot for Lee seems a convoluted to me.

With Nick Johnson (http://www.baseball-reference.com/player_search.cgi?search=Nick+Johnson&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker) potentially out for the season, an offensive addition would be more fitting. To that end, King says the Yankees have scouts following the Astros in case Lance Berkman (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/berkmla01.shtml?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker) becomes available. Berkman is still owed $11.2MM heading into today's action, however.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/06/mariners-expect-yankees-to-pursue-cliff-lee.html

There is so much wrong with this I dont even know where to start but I'll try.

First and foremost its George King

Second, Im almost upset for MLB Traderumors and excellent site to post a rumor based on people "familiar with the Mariners thought process" thats got to be the worst source Ive ever heard.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 11:00 AM
King said it this morning:

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yankees/expect_yanks_to_make_cliff_bid_pKw2dvYWZbB9nA0OjQAm2K

Exactly, that's all we needed to know (King)...

b_joseph
06-09-10, 11:03 AM
First time in a while that I dont think we really need a Starter...King just likes to gossip.

LazyEyeLou
06-09-10, 11:03 AM
So dumb, and not going to happen. Lee will end up with a contender, but it won't be us.

TheHugeUnit2
06-09-10, 11:07 AM
Meh on Lee, now that Berkman news has me a bit interested. High OBP and maybe playing for a team that actually wins games might give him some extra motivation.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 11:08 AM
Meh on Lee, now that Berkman news has me a bit interested. High OBP and maybe playing for a team that actually wins games might give him some extra motivation.

The issue is, he's going to want his monster option picked up for 2011 in order to waive his NTC. No team in their right mind would do that. I'm a big fan of his and would love him in the lineup, so long as Jorge can catch.

TheGameEpisode2
06-09-10, 11:10 AM
Hasn't Berkman said that he would only accept a trade if the team getting him picks up his option for next year?

Hitman23
06-09-10, 11:15 AM
I would love to see Berkman DHing

Yankee Fan in Boston
06-09-10, 11:19 AM
The issue is, he's going to want his monster option picked up for 2011 in order to waive his NTC. No team in their right mind would do that. I'm a big fan of his and would love him in the lineup, so long as Jorge can catch.

That's the rub. Montero's might not be as sure a thing for next year as he was, but I'd be hesistant to put a big contract at DH for next year given our team's makeup. Further, if it comes down to a budget, that contract might hurt your chances at signing Lee

JOBA RULES
06-09-10, 11:20 AM
We don't need a pitcher....Especially one whos a FA next year and especially not for one of our top prospects. We need a DH or a bat off the bench...Last year Hinskie was a very nice fit for the type of team we had. We need someone like that. Last year with Hairston and Hinskie our bench was pretty damn good. This year...not so much.

JohnnyEllis
06-09-10, 11:26 AM
Our main trade will be for a bat.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 11:28 AM
That's the rub. Montero's might not be as sure a thing for next year as he was, but I'd be hesistant to put a big contract at DH for next year given our team's makeup. Further, if it comes down to a budget, that contract might hurt your chances at signing Lee

Picking up his $15M option is absolutely a non-option. It'll kill our chances of basically doing anything this coming offseason. Any team that trades for Berkman (even if he doesn't require the option picked up to waive NTC) will be on the hook for his $2M buyout for 2011, too.

Mark19
06-09-10, 11:31 AM
Our main trade will be for a bat.

Berkman was mentioned by George King - who has been slightly more believable lately

I like the idea of him as a DH and occasional 1B/OF - the only problem is that he still has $10 million coming his way. I wonder what the Astros would want in return.

I'd actually prefer we look at someone like Ryan Doumit. He can be the third catcher as well as a backup at 1B and OF. He's a switch-hitter who tends to do better against RHP.

parkerstrong
06-09-10, 11:35 AM
We don't have a need for a SP during this season-Cliff Lee is a FA option, not a trade option. I would love to have him next year though....

I'm not a fan of trading for a DH. I don't think we should trade prospects for someone that is only a rental-we need DH available for Posada next year.

Only spot I think we look to trade for is a reliever or an injury replacement.

R.V.47
06-09-10, 11:41 AM
Berkman was mentioned by George King - who has been slightly more believable lately

I like the idea of him as a DH and occasional 1B/OF - the only problem is that he still has $10 million coming his way. I wonder what the Astros would want in return.

I'd actually prefer we look at someone like Ryan Doumit. He can be the third catcher as well as a backup at 1B and OF. He's a switch-hitter who tends to do better against RHP.

I agree with someone like Doumit. If we make a trade Id rather make it for a player who could help us beyond just the 2nd half of the season. That way giving up prospects doesnt hurt as much.

Id like to see what it would take for Shin Soo Choo, hed slide right into the 2 spot in the order. Only problem with him hes such a good outfielder it would be a waste to have him DH.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 11:43 AM
I agree with someone like Doumit. If we make a trade Id rather make it for a player who could help us beyond just the 2nd half of the season. That way giving up prospects doesnt hurt as much.

Id like to see what it would take for Shin Soo Choo, hed slide right into the 2 spot in the order. Only problem with him hes such a good outfielder it would be a waste to have him DH.

Choo is literally the most valuable player they have. He'd cost a TON.

Mark19
06-09-10, 11:45 AM
Choo is literally the most valuable player they have. He'd cost a TON.

Concur, he is the Indians single most valuable player - his pending military obligation could also complicate any potential deal

TheInfallibleOne
06-09-10, 11:54 AM
Maybe a trade for Lee isn't such a terrible idea. But under the right conditions. Instead of giving up multiple top prospects, maybe give them Nunez and take back an unfavorable contract (Bradley?) as well. If we can extend Lee, and offer arb to Javy at the end of the year, we can end up with more draft picks AND a better big league club down the stretch.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 11:55 AM
Maybe a trade for Lee isn't such a terrible idea. But under the right conditions. Instead of giving up multiple top prospects, maybe give them Nunez and take back an unfavorable contract (Bradley?) as well. If we can extend Lee, and offer arb to Javy at the end of the year, we can end up with more draft picks AND a better big league club down the stretch.

A 6-man rotation?

Yankee Fan in Boston
06-09-10, 11:59 AM
A 6-man rotation?

Hughes is a great 8th inning guy

Yankee Fan in Boston
06-09-10, 12:00 PM
Maybe a trade for Lee isn't such a terrible idea. But under the right conditions. Instead of giving up multiple top prospects, maybe give them Nunez and take back an unfavorable contract (Bradley?) as well. If we can extend Lee, and offer arb to Javy at the end of the year, we can end up with more draft picks AND a better big league club down the stretch.

I am happy to be wrong, but I don't get the sense that Seattle is a financially desperate team. I suspect they'd rather have talent than salary relief.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 12:01 PM
I am happy to be wrong, but I don't get the sense that Seattle is a financially desperate team. I suspect they'd rather have talent than salary relief.

Yeah. I think they'd prefer the two picks over Nunez and salary relief. Nunez isn't worth what King is making him out to be. Kinda funny.

Yankee Tripper
06-09-10, 12:17 PM
Yeah. I think they'd prefer the two picks over Nunez and salary relief. Nunez isn't worth what King is making him out to be. Kinda funny.It is the Romine/Montero part of the deal that would bring Lee to the Bronx, not the nunez part.

Though I honestly don't see a need for Lee in trade unless a starter gets hurt.

teknetic
06-09-10, 12:18 PM
Concur, he is the Indians single most valuable player - his pending military obligation could also complicate any potential deal

Pretty sure it was mentioned that he doesn't actually have to serve and that they were gonna work around it.

JohnnyEllis
06-09-10, 12:27 PM
Hughes is a great 8th inning guy

Funny.

BronxYanks45
06-09-10, 12:38 PM
I'd trade for Montero for Lee and sign him to an extension. Montero is batting something like .229 this year in AAA and his defense isnt improving.

if we get Lee then we can skip Hughes more starts to keep his workload light.

Romine is our future catcher for sure.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 12:39 PM
I'd trade for Montero for Lee and sign him to an extension. Montero is batting something like .229 this year in AAA and his defense isnt improving.

if we get Lee then we can skip Hughes more starts to keep his workload light.

Romine is our future catcher for sure.

This post will not be well-received.

teknetic
06-09-10, 12:39 PM
I'd trade for Montero for Lee and sign him to an extension. Montero is batting something like .229 this year in AAA and his defense isnt improving.

if we get Lee then we can skip Hughes more starts to keep his workload light.

Romine is our future catcher for sure.

Awful.

TheInfallibleOne
06-09-10, 01:09 PM
Yeah. I think they'd prefer the two picks over Nunez and salary relief. Nunez isn't worth what King is making him out to be. Kinda funny.

Their preference becomes less relevant if we are the only bidder for Lee.


It is the Romine/Montero part of the deal that would bring Lee to the Bronx, not the nunez part.

Though I honestly don't see a need for Lee in trade unless a starter gets hurt.

Romine/Montero could be dangled in other trades as well, and Cashman would sooner cut off a limb than surrender a top prospect like that. I don't know of anyone else that would surrender what the Brewers did for CC in 2008.

If Seattle is desperate to be rid of Lee, I think a fleecing is in order.

R.V.47
06-09-10, 01:19 PM
Their preference becomes less relevant if we are the only bidder for Lee.



Romine/Montero could be dangled in other trades as well, and Cashman would sooner cut off a limb than surrender a top prospect like that. I don't know of anyone else that would surrender what the Brewers did for CC in 2008.

If Seattle is desperate to be rid of Lee, I think a fleecing is in order.

They dont have to be desperate to deal him Im sure theyd take the picks.

Tifoso
06-09-10, 01:19 PM
Hughes is a great 8th inning guy

He's in the rotation permanently :)

CC
Lee
AJ
Andy
Phil

Vasquez traded, for some RP.

I could see that happening

The way Andy is pitching right now, he might move up (and yes, I know that doesn't matter much in the RS ;) )

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 01:24 PM
I think it's worth noting that Vazquez is improving his trade value dramatically. If the Yankees want to pull a 3-way in which they dump Vaz and land Lee, I'm sure it would be possible at this point.

Tifoso
06-09-10, 01:29 PM
I think it's worth noting that Vazquez is improving his trade value dramatically. If the Yankees want to pull a 3-way in which they dump Vaz and land Lee, I'm sure it would be possible at this point.

Agreed.

teknetic
06-09-10, 01:29 PM
Yanks get Lee
Mariners get Berkman
Astros get Vasquez + prospects

Make it happen.

Tifoso
06-09-10, 01:32 PM
Yanks get Lee
Mariners get Berkman
Astros get Vasquez + prospects

Make it happen.

I like:)

TheInfallibleOne
06-09-10, 01:33 PM
Yanks get Lee
Mariners get Berkman
Astros get Vasquez + prospects

Make it happen.

Why do the Mariners want Berkman? Theyre last in their division, and draft picks are worth more to them than Lance is.

Same thing for the Astros, theyre selling, what good is Javy to them?

teknetic
06-09-10, 01:34 PM
I was being serious.

Hitman23
06-09-10, 01:36 PM
Yanks get Lee
Mariners get Berkman
Astros get Vasquez + prospects

Make it happen.grumble..... why would anyone truly believe it is feasible that the Yankees could unload their worst starting pitcher to date for one of the best pitchers in baseball? It's like Cashman is believed to have the Jedi mind trick or something. :lol:

Vazquez has value, and I agree it's increasing. I just don't see landing a guy like Lee unless the Yankees give something up as well.

TheHugeUnit2
06-09-10, 01:40 PM
Yanks get Lee
Mariners get Berkman
Astros get Vasquez + prospects

Make it happen.
Well if thats the route...

Yankees get Lee
Red Sox get Igawa
M's get Lester.

Everyone wins!

parkerstrong
06-09-10, 01:41 PM
I'd trade for Montero for Lee and sign him to an extension. Montero is batting something like .229 this year in AAA and his defense isnt improving.

if we get Lee then we can skip Hughes more starts to keep his workload light.

Romine is our future catcher for sure.

Yeah, this isn't a good idea because Montero's ceiling is immense. He is 20 years old-its okay if he isnt dominating AAA yet. I would not trade Montero for Lee when we can just sign him at the end of the season. No thanks

JOBA RULES
06-09-10, 01:45 PM
http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee282/matthewfuntime/TMF/fatmike.png doesn't want Lee this year

Tifoso
06-09-10, 01:46 PM
grumble..... why would anyone truly believe it is feasible that the Yankees could unload their worst starting pitcher to date for one of the best pitchers in baseball? It's like Cashman is believed to have the Jedi mind trick or something. :lol:

Vazquez has value, and I agree it's increasing. I just don't see landing a guy like Lee unless the Yankees give something up as well.

Vasquez+Joba+1-2 B prospects

*Ducks thrown objects*

Also, Lee will be worth next to nothing for them unless they trade before the deadline. He is a FA after the season, right?

They are in a very bad bargaining position.

Tifoso
06-09-10, 01:48 PM
http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee282/matthewfuntime/TMF/fatmike.png doesn't want Lee this year



:roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::roflmao:

Hitman23
06-09-10, 01:50 PM
Vasquez+Joba+1-2 B prospects

*Ducks thrown objects*

Also, Lee will be worth next to nothing for them unless they trade before the deadline. He is a FA after the season, right?

They are in a very bad bargaining position.I dunno man. You can't just be blinded by the fact that you want Lee and want to get rid of a few players you wouldn't mind losing. On the Mariners' side they have a guy that can help any contending team win a World Series and even if he doesn't have any value after the season teams will pay for the rental. The Yankees aren't the only team in the hunt you can't just toss Vazquez and Joba at them and say "give me one of the best pitchers in baseball".

And this Strasburg crap I'm hearing? :lol: Yes everyone, the Nationals drafted and introduced this kid to the world, put him in the spotlight, showcased him for everyone to see and are just going to hand him over to the Yankees now. Hey thanks for babysitting DC! You done good.

It's like awesome players are just destined for the Yankees and the Yankees alone. :lol:

Hitman23
06-09-10, 01:52 PM
http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee282/matthewfuntime/TMF/fatmike.png doesn't want Lee this yearoh my god that is hilarious!! :roflmao:

teknetic
06-09-10, 01:52 PM
grumble..... why would anyone truly believe it is feasible that the Yankees could unload their worst starting pitcher to date for one of the best pitchers in baseball? It's like Cashman is believed to have the Jedi mind trick or something. :lol:

Vazquez has value, and I agree it's increasing. I just don't see landing a guy like Lee unless the Yankees give something up as well.

It was the start of a long ling of terrible trade proposals to come. It wasn't a serious offer, the Mariners aren't gonna be on the hook for Berkman's option and I doubt he'd even accept a trade from one hopeless franchise to another.

Hitman23
06-09-10, 01:55 PM
It was the start of a long ling of terrible trade proposals to come. It wasn't a serious offer, the Mariners aren't gonna be on the hook for Berkman's option and I doubt he'd even accept a trade from one hopeless franchise to another.Oh, you're mocking things..... that's different then. :D

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 01:57 PM
I never proposed a Vazquez to M's, I just said a 3-way in which we get Lee, someone gets Vazquez and prospects are exchanged from our end.

Hitman23
06-09-10, 02:02 PM
I never proposed a Vazquez to M's, I just said a 3-way in which we get Lee, someone gets Vazquez and prospects are exchanged from our end.But it's the same thing. You want to land Cliff Lee, one of the best pitchers in baseball, and only give up a struggling pitcher who is just now starting to find his bearings and a couple of minor league players? If the other team involved had the chips to pry Cliff Lee loose why wouldn't they just get Cliff Lee? Why would they want Javy instead? It just doesn't make any sense.

Who knows though, crazier stuff has happened.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 02:06 PM
But it's the same thing. You want to land Cliff Lee, one of the best pitchers in baseball, and only give up a struggling pitcher who is just now starting to find his bearings and a couple of minor league players? If the other team involved had the chips to pry Cliff Lee loose why wouldn't they just get Cliff Lee? Why would they want Javy instead? It just doesn't make any sense.

Who knows though, crazier stuff has happened.

A few things.

- A 3-way doesn't always involve all 3 teams working together. The Phils-M's-Jays basically pulled one off this offseason. I guess in a sense I meant we should trade Javy for package X and then trade whatever for Lee.

- Lee is not going to re-sign with a trading team. Vazquez may very well. Lee not re-signing is a real why the Phils rushed to trade him and deal for Halladay last offseason.

- Vazquez will cost the trading team considerably less than Lee will, in terms of prospects.

parkerstrong
06-09-10, 02:06 PM
Vasquez+Joba+1-2 B prospects

*Ducks thrown objects*

Also, Lee will be worth next to nothing for them unless they trade before the deadline. He is a FA after the season, right?

They are in a very bad bargaining position.

Mariners would be better off with two first round picks.....

2PhonesMaccabee
06-09-10, 02:07 PM
We need relievers and hitters not starters.

murpjf88
06-09-10, 02:33 PM
I don't want to drain the farm system for another top flight starting pitcher when he becomes a free agent in the off-season. Javy is a capable fifth starter and you only need three solid starting pitchers in the post season and we have four. The biggest problem is in the bullpen and that's where Cash should be focused. It wouldn't hurt to add another capable bat as well.

Hitman23
06-09-10, 02:45 PM
A few things.

- A 3-way doesn't always involve all 3 teams working together. The Phils-M's-Jays basically pulled one off this offseason. I guess in a sense I meant we should trade Javy for package X and then trade whatever for Lee.

- Lee is not going to re-sign with a trading team. Vazquez may very well. Lee not re-signing is a real why the Phils rushed to trade him and deal for Halladay last offseason.

- Vazquez will cost the trading team considerably less than Lee will, in terms of prospects.Well see this is why I supervise a receiving department and there are those who get paid to make trades for Cliff Lee. :lol: I'll trust that it's possible if you say it is, all I know is if I were a Mariners fan I'd want someone like Hughes in return for Lee at least. Not someone's second hand junk and a few prospects.

NYYRules#1
06-09-10, 02:54 PM
To hell with Cliff Lee.

I say Strasburg for Igawa straight up. And if Washington won't accept, make it an offer they can't refuse.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 02:57 PM
Well see this is why I supervise a receiving department and there are those who get paid to make trades for Cliff Lee. :lol: I'll trust that it's possible if you say it is, all I know is if I were a Mariners fan I'd want someone like Hughes in return for Lee at least. Not someone's second hand junk and a few prospects.

Lee is an upcoming free agent and their team is is going nowhere. They have a choice to make - trade Lee for the talent equivalent (or slightly more) of 2 draft picks, or keep him and get the picks themselves.

DEADSOX
06-09-10, 03:40 PM
Makes absolutely no sense to trade for Lee.

Yankeeah
06-09-10, 03:45 PM
Makes absolutely no sense to trade for Lee.

I'd rather trade for a solid reliever.

1970cs
06-09-10, 03:45 PM
We need relievers and hitters not starters.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/05/heath-bells-trade-value-updated.html
The Padres still may consider trading Heath Bell because their bullpen actually has some depth. He is owed 4m this year and more in arbitration over the winter. San Diego needs a cheap bat for their outfield.

Tifoso
06-09-10, 03:50 PM
To hell with Cliff Lee.

I say Strasburg for Igawa straight up. And if Washington won't accept, make it an offer they can't refuse.


:lol:

flymick24
06-09-10, 03:56 PM
if yankees have scouts as astros games, it's not beyond the realm of possibility that they're scouting both berkman and lee (to fill the DH void)

they could also be looking at LHP tim byrdak or lindstrom

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 03:59 PM
if yankees have scouts as astros games, it's not beyond the realm of possibility that they're scouting both berkman and lee (to fill the DH void)

they could also be looking at LHP tim byrdak or lindstrom

Carlos Lee....:eek:

flymick24
06-09-10, 04:02 PM
Carlos Lee....:eek:

lee still has 2 more years on his contract after this year and it's hideous

courtesy of cott's:

10:$18.5M, 11:$18.5M, 12:$18.5M

have the astros subsidize about half of it, send them kevin russo and nova, and have the DH problem solved for a few years

jimmykey2
06-09-10, 04:02 PM
if yankees have scouts as astros games, it's not beyond the realm of possibility that they're scouting both berkman and lee (to fill the DH void)

they could also be looking at LHP tim byrdak or lindstrom

It's quite sad that Tim Brydak is the only player in that group I'd want to see in Pinstripes. Good LOOGY.

THEBOSS84
06-09-10, 04:04 PM
lee still has 2 more years on his contract after this year and it's hideous

courtesy of cott's:

10:$18.5M, 11:$18.5M, 12:$18.5M

have the astros subsidize about half of it, send them kevin russo and nova, and have the DH problem solved for a few years

Based on how he's played this year, I wouldn't take him for free.

Yankee Tripper
06-09-10, 04:07 PM
Romine/Montero could be dangled in other trades as well, and Cashman would sooner cut off a limb than surrender a top prospect like that. I don't know of anyone else that would surrender what the Brewers did for CC in 2008.

If Seattle is desperate to be rid of Lee, I think a fleecing is in order.
See that's just it, they are not. They have cash so getting 2 picks isn't a bad deal for them should Lee walk. Only if they can do better than 2 picks will they deal. I'm not saying the Yanks should deal one of Romine/Montero to get Lee, I'm just saying that is one of them would be the cost if Seattle would consider dealing him.

Now a guy like Ben Sheets is different, the A's will take probably mid-level prospects to deal out his contract. Not saying the Yanks should go after sheets, they should not, just using Oakland as cash stapped team as oppsoed to the Ms who actually have money. Though with Oakland with in a game of 1st and the West weak, Sheets is probably not yet on the market.

2PhonesMaccabee
06-09-10, 06:25 PM
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/05/heath-bells-trade-value-updated.html
The Padres still may consider trading Heath Bell because their bullpen actually has some depth. He is owed 4m this year and more in arbitration over the winter. San Diego needs a cheap bat for their outfield.I would love to have Bell, but right now we don't have a hitter to give up to get him.

PinstripesintheBronx
06-09-10, 06:36 PM
Is this Cliff Lee rumor legit?

Yankeeah
06-09-10, 06:38 PM
3:56pm: A Yankees official told Mark Feinsand of the New York Daily News that the team has no urgency to do anything with their rotation, which isn't necessarily at odds with King's report below. In other words, the Mariners might like the Yankees to get involved on Lee, but so far they're not.

More interesting is the team official's suggestion that only three players have been made available across baseball so far, and Lee is not among them.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/06/mariners-expect-yankees-to-pursue-cliff-lee.html

murpjf88
06-09-10, 06:42 PM
Is this Cliff Lee rumor legit?

According to the Bleacher Report, Yanks not interested.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/403716-yankees-trade-rumors-yanks-not-interested-in-cliff-lee

The FUTURE
06-09-10, 07:54 PM
HEATH BELL....that's a worthy and legit target for the trading deadline...I can't Lee is out of the question.

flymick24
06-09-10, 07:56 PM
3:56pm: A Yankees official told Mark Feinsand of the New York Daily News that the team has no urgency to do anything with their rotation, which isn't necessarily at odds with King's report below. In other words, the Mariners might like the Yankees to get involved on Lee, but so far they're not.

More interesting is the team official's suggestion that only three players have been made available across baseball so far, and Lee is not among them.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/06/mariners-expect-yankees-to-pursue-cliff-lee.html

Konerko, Berkman, Oswalt

murpjf88
06-09-10, 07:58 PM
Konerko, Berkman, Oswalt

Pass on all three.

NYYDragoon
06-09-10, 08:11 PM
Makes absolutely no sense to trade for Lee.Seriously. Wait until he hits free agency.

The M's are just trying to make talk.

BroadwayBomber55
06-09-10, 11:58 PM
Seriously. Wait until he hits free agency.

The M's are just trying to make talk.
And go for the moon with the Yankees offers while being a teachers pet with the others and take baloney, lopsided deals to other big name teams.

Dexter Morgan
06-10-10, 12:38 AM
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/Mariners-ace-Cliff-Lee-will-eventually-end-up-as-a-New-York-Yankee


Yanks will get Lee — but when?

Ken Rosenthal
Updated Jun 9, 2010 7:55 PM ET

The Yankees are going to end up with Mariners left-hander Cliff Lee. The only question is whether they land him in a trade this summer or as a free agent this winter — and a trade might not be as far-fetched as it appears.

True, the Yankees currently boast five healthy and effective starters. True, they simply could wait for Lee to become a free agent and sign him in the offseason without losing any young talent. But one rival executive says the Yankees will be undeterred in their pursuit of Lee on the trade market.

His reasoning is simple.

“Top of the rotation starter,” the exec says.

In fact, the Yankees might even have landed Lee last winter if the Phillies had been more willing to trade the left-hander to the team that beat them in the World Series.

The Phillies, who drew criticism within the industry for not shopping Lee more aggressively, actually approached the Yankees in the final 36 to 48 hours before completing the three-team blockbuster that brought right-hander Roy Halladay to Philadelphia and sent Lee to Seattle, major-league sources said.

The Yankees were willing to include top catching prospect Jesus Montero in a package for Lee, according to two sources. But the Phillies’ overall asking price was so high, the talks never advanced, another source said.

The dynamic now is different; the Yankees’ rotation is perhaps their greatest strength, ranking second in the American League in ERA. Javier Vazquez is pitching better. Phil Hughes is developing into a star. And remember, the Yankees refrained from trading for Johan Santana after the 2007 season in order to wait for CC Sabathia as a free agent the following year.

The Mariners, however, are preparing for the Yankees to pursue Lee, according to the New York Post, which quoted a “person familiar with Seattle’s thought process” as saying the team would ask for one of the Yankees’ young catchers as well as Triple A shortstop Eduardo Nunez.

The Yankees, to part with such a package, would want assurances that they could sign Lee to an extension, the Post said.

The Mariners, according to the newspaper, already are scouting the Yankees’ farm system. The Yankees, in turn, are certain to scout Lee in the coming weeks, but perhaps only as preparation for his free agency. Yankees scouts saw approximately 20 of Sabathia’s starts in 2008 before the team signed him as a free agent at the end of that season.

Lee repeatedly has made it clear that he wants to hit the open market, but the Yankees almost certainly will be his high bidder and perhaps he would make an exception to get to them sooner.

The Mariners would need to grant the Yankees permission to open a negotiating window with Lee for such a deal to transpire.

Lee, for his part, is leaving his options open regarding a possible extension.

“If we were to get to that point, we would just take it on a team-by-team basis,” Lee’s agent Darek Braunecker, said.

Next year.

CC Sabathia
Cliff Lee
A.J. Burnett
Phil Hughes

Whatever happens...I think their is a better than 50% chance Lee is our #2 starter next year.

murpjf88
06-10-10, 01:10 AM
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/Mariners-ace-Cliff-Lee-will-eventually-end-up-as-a-New-York-Yankee



Next year.

CC Sabathia
Cliff Lee
A.J. Burnett
Phil Hughes

Whatever happens...I think their is a better than 50% chance Lee is our #2 starter next year.

Their is no 50% about it. Hell, he would be the no. 1 starter if it were up to me.

Metroidman
06-10-10, 01:25 AM
Just please don't sign him for over 4 years

DiMaggio5CF
06-10-10, 01:36 AM
I just don't see the point of trading a top prospect when it's almost a stone-cold lock guarantee that he'll be a free agent at the end of this season.

If there was really a need in the starting rotation, maybe I'd feel differently. But the way things are going right now, I just don't see the point.

EDIT: I guess the point would be to stay out of a bidding war with other clubs, but Lee seems so determined to get a big paycheck that, while he might sign an extension with the Yankees figuring that's where he'd wind up as a free agent anyway, I don't see him doing it without raking the Yankees over the coals.

EDIT: I also find it very hard to believe that the Yankees agreed to give up Montero for Lee. Lee is very good, but as good as he is, I think it's clear that Halladay is better, and the Yankees refused to part with Montero for Halladay. So unless something happened to Montero where the Yankees suddenly don't think he's as good as they did a year or two ago, I don't see them agreeing to trade him now for Lee.

ThePinStripes
06-10-10, 03:40 AM
Didn't see this anywhere, and its probably about time to get the rumor mill and subsequent discussion going.

I'll start:

What is all this crap I hear about Nunez and Romine/Montero to the Mariners for Lee? In what world would Cashman bid against himself like this for a rental when he can keep the prospects and get Lee in FA?

EDIT: LINK (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/rumors/post/Mariners-want-Lee-trade-with-Yankees?urn=mlb,246833)

We would have gotten Halladay if we wanted to trade Montero + others. Cliff Lee is second class pitcher in comparison to Doc.
The only way we get him is if he comes super cheap. Lee won't sign an extension b/c he knows the Yankees will be contenders. The Mariners can't squat for him because he won't sign an extension and everyone knows the Yankees will bid for him in the off-season. If this leads to a highway-robbery Cliff Lee fire sale, so be it. They should get about what 2 draft picks are worth and maybe a bit more. Otherwise, the Yankees are waiting and no one else is interested.



Only thing Cashman MIGHT be interested outside the above scenario is a few bullpen arms. Look at our lineup. Who are we going to upgrade? At full strength (playoff strength) our #9 hitter is .300 hitter with incredible speed and fantastic defense. With Javy coming around, our rotation looks great. Barring injury, the bullpen is the only weakness in this team.

aeromac76
06-10-10, 07:55 AM
In an ideal world I focus on the pen and a bat.
Lee, and/or the rotation, is not really on the radar now at face value, but there are some mitigating circumstances here.

1) Our own rotation itself. So far, so good. But we are not looking to have the best rotation in June, it's October we are worried about. Looking at this from a worst case scenario (and again, I mean worst case scenario), CC has been putrid against any team not named the Orioles. Burnett can still be hit or miss, Pettitte is getting close to 40 and will have a long season under him by October, Hughes is a kid with innings limits and Vaz, who knows what you'll get with him? And there is always the threat of injury to any pitcher.
Now in the playoffs you have to assume we won't bet by again with 3 starters, esp with the new schedules which are eliminationg a lot of off days. So looking at the abive 5 guys, we can take on a loss or bad performance of 1 of them, but after that, it starts affecting the guys who may pitch playoff games, Getting Lee is the greatest homeowners insurance policy against that.

Now even having said that, I'd take my chances there, but there is something else:

2) A trade. In many ways I was rooting for Seattle to be good, so they'd run with Lee to the close of the year, he'd get to free agency and we sign him. Vaz and Pettitte are both free agents next year and due to retirement or changing teams, we are likely to want another starter from the outside and Lee is perfect and would be our first choice. We know that. But Seattle is tanking and that means if they trade him, unless they take a near zero package for a half year rental, there is a chance that whomever they deal him to will lock him up, and then we've lost him. So that does add to the chance we simply go get him via trade and then trade another starter like Vaz for help elsewhere.
It's not my first choice, but I'd hate to see him get dealt elsewhere and then sign an extension.

YankeePride1967
06-10-10, 08:07 AM
I wouldn't worry about trading for Carlos Lee. Lee has a no trade clause and due to his involvement with the rodeo he has said he would veto any trade.

nnysiny
06-10-10, 08:20 AM
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/Mariners-ace-Cliff-Lee-will-eventually-end-up-as-a-New-York-Yankee
it sounds like Montero is destined to be traded

JDPNYY
06-10-10, 08:29 AM
Sheesh. George King floats a rumor and the media takes the ball and runs.

R.V.47
06-10-10, 08:48 AM
I was very surprised reading that article that the yankees were willing to include Montero in a deal for Lee. Monteros value couldnt be any higher coming off of last years minor league season and it seemed like he was on track to maybe help the team this year. I hope this isnt a case of the yankees knowing something about this guy that doesnt seem right to them.

wang+cano=future
06-10-10, 09:14 AM
I was very surprised reading that article that the yankees were willing to include Montero in a deal for Lee. Monteros value couldnt be any higher coming off of last years minor league season and it seemed like he was on track to maybe help the team this year. I hope this isnt a case of the yankees knowing something about this guy that doesnt seem right to them.

I reallly really really question that the Yanks were willing to trade Montero for Lee. I could be wrong and the report could be legit, but it seems really unlikely.....

R.V.47
06-10-10, 09:27 AM
I reallly really really question that the Yanks were willing to trade Montero for Lee. I could be wrong and the report could be legit, but it seems really unlikely.....

The only scenario I could see where they would go that route is if there were people inside the organization who had serious doubts about Hughes as a starter in 2010. We know they had and still have serious doubts about Joba. Plus it was a weak FA class for pitching, looks like a good idea staying away from Lackey. Plus they didnt seem to be real players for Halladay. There might have been a feeling of desperation that they had to do a deal for another front line starter because they know how they lucky they were with the schedule being able to use 3 starters in the playoffs.

JOBA RULES
06-10-10, 09:29 AM
If Montero gets traded I will be pissed.

Yankee Fan in Boston
06-10-10, 09:38 AM
I reallly really really question that the Yanks were willing to trade Montero for Lee. I could be wrong and the report could be legit, but it seems really unlikely.....

I tend to agree. I don't doubt that his name was brought up (by the Phillies) and maybe they Yankees were trying to get a sense of what it would take to get Lee, but I doubt they were really going to trade him.

Regardless, it's even less likely they trade for Lee now, short of some major injuries. It's ridiculous how this rumor has spread given how one-sided the info is and how contrary it is to Cashman's approach

BronxYanks45
06-10-10, 10:02 AM
If Montero gets traded I will be pissed.

why, poor defense and batting now .217 in AAA. Montero will need another year of AAA and that means leaving Romine in AA hurting his development. Since Montero cant get his act together they'll probably trade him and he'll end up becoming someones Victor Martinez. Good bat poor defense, proabably ending up at 1B.

Look if you dont resign Vasquez and Pettitte retires you need TWO starters and Lee would be a perfect #3

CC
AJ
Lee
Hughes
McAllister or Vasquez

I wouldnt be surprised (though I wont like it) if we trade Montero for Lee, and put Hughes in the pen so he wont pass his innings limit. It would be stupid but having 6 starters is not cool

R.V.47
06-10-10, 10:07 AM
why, poor defense and batting now .217 in AAA. Montero will need another year of AAA and that means leaving Romine in AA hurting his development. Since Montero cant get his act together they'll probably trade him and he'll end up becoming someones Victor Martinez. Good bat poor defense, proabably ending up at 1B.

Look if you dont resign Vasquez and Pettitte retires you need TWO starters and Lee would be a perfect #3

CC
AJ
Lee
Hughes
McAllister or Vasquez

I wouldnt be surprised (though I wont like it) if we trade Montero for Lee, and put Hughes in the pen so he wont pass his innings limit. It would be stupid but having 6 starters is not cool

If Montero turns out to hit like Victor Martinez then hes in line to have a very good career. And not resigning Vazquez and Pettitte retiring is all happening after the season when Lee is a FA anyway so trading for him now would make no sense at all.

THEBOSS84
06-10-10, 10:10 AM
I'd sign up right now for Montero to be the next Victor Martinez. Is that supposed to be a bad thing??

primetime714
06-10-10, 10:25 AM
I'd only trade for Lee now if the deal included Javy Vazquez going somewhere else and we didn't have to give up Romine or Montero. I'd have no qualms about giving up any other player in the system midseason as we'd basically get that back by not having to give up a 1st round pick to sign Lee, but Romine and Montero have to be off limits.

With our rotation as it stands right now Lee would be a luxury. Our rotation includes the 3 playoff starters from last year's world championship team, a young Cy Young contender (Hughes), and a guy that was an NL Cy Young contender last year and is now rounding into form (Vazquez). The rotation is the strongest part of our team. If the price is right (see first paragraph) I'd love to get Lee now and add him for another playoff run, but I see no reason to jump the gun unless the situation is in our favor.

On another note I find the report that we were willing to give up a package including Montero for Lee this offseason to be a little questionable at best. If we were only willing to give Montero alone for Halladay would we really give up Montero in a package for Lee? Maybe if the package was a bunch of scrubs + Montero but even then I find it odd that we would give up essentially the same amount for Lee that we would've for Halladay. The Yankees probably like Lee a lot and for good reason, but Halladay is clearly the better of the two.

TheInfallibleOne
06-10-10, 11:33 AM
I would give the Mariners 3 B prospects with upside. That sounds like its worth a bit more than the ~30th pick next year and a supplemental pick, which is what they would get when Lee signs here in the offseason.

In exchange for this, we ask for an extension window with Lee, but don't press the issue. If we dont get it, we'll offer arb anyway. That way we can offer arb to every FA we have, and hope they all decline.

In the offseason, we resign Jeter, Rivera, Lee and maybe Andy. Javy gets an arb offer, and if he accepts, we can ask Andy to hold off on signing for the year until Javy gets traded. If he declines, sign Andy right away and enjoy the two extra picks.

ojo
06-10-10, 12:08 PM
I'd sign up right now for Montero to be the next Victor Martinez. Is that supposed to be a bad thing??


no offense to victor martinez, but...i'd consider it a let down.

montero is supposed to develop prodigal power with eye-hand ala frank the tank.

jimmykey2
06-10-10, 12:33 PM
If Montero gets traded I will be pissed.

I don't think you have to worry about it. The org. loves Montero's ceiling and Cashman hasn't shown any desire to trade high ceiling players for 30+ year-olds.

THEBOSS84
06-10-10, 12:36 PM
I don't think you have to worry about it. The org. loves Montero's ceiling and Cashman hasn't shown any desire to trade high ceiling players for 30+ year-olds.

Not so sure about that. So far there have been rumors that he offered Montero for BOTH Halladay and Lee.

JavyVazquezIsSick
06-10-10, 12:40 PM
My source has told me we are close to getting a White Sox reliever.

Oh yeah, Romine and Nunez for Cliff Lee? See ya.

THEBOSS84
06-10-10, 12:42 PM
You have sources?

teknetic
06-10-10, 12:43 PM
it sounds like Montero is destined to be traded

No it isn't, you might be ready to run him out of town, but the Yankees don't give up on an elite prospect two months into a season.


why, poor defense and batting now .217 in AAA. Montero will need another year of AAA and that means leaving Romine in AA hurting his development. Since Montero cant get his act together they'll probably trade him and he'll end up becoming someones Victor Martinez. Good bat poor defense, proabably ending up at 1B.

You made this post already and it's still as awful as the first time.

NYYDragoon
06-10-10, 12:53 PM
I think people are forgetting that we have a solid 5-man rotation. Where exactly would Lee go?

And lol to people giving up on Montero already. Wow.

Tehasguard
06-10-10, 12:57 PM
My source has told me we are close to getting a White Sox reliever.

Oh yeah, Romine and Nunez for Cliff Lee? See ya.

Was thinking about Linebrink,

but his numbers are bad :/


Jenks hans't been very good either... so maybe his value is low enough to make a decent trade

JfromJersey
06-10-10, 01:01 PM
I think people are forgetting that we have a solid 5-man rotation. Where exactly would Lee go?

And lol to people giving up on Montero already. Wow.

Javy would have to go. It;s just not going to happen. I could see Cashman going for a DH more than a SP.

Agree with you on Jesus.

Vazquez
06-10-10, 01:11 PM
good lord do not want Jenks.

I love Lee but would not give up Montero. Romine/Nunez and window for extension a requirement - for sure.

aeromac76
06-10-10, 01:12 PM
My source has told me we are close to getting a White Sox reliever.

Oh yeah, Romine and Nunez for Cliff Lee? See ya.

JVIS,
Thanks for the info!
May I inquire as to the nature of your source? Not identity more like "he works for a newspaper" or "she works in a front office".
Nothing specific I know, if you cannot even reveal that, I understand and appreciate you passing the news on in any event!

And I agree with you regarding the Lee deal.

TheInfallibleOne
06-10-10, 01:15 PM
My source has told me we are close to getting a White Sox reliever.

Oh yeah, Romine and Nunez for Cliff Lee? See ya.


Hopefully not Linebrink...

just-blaze
06-10-10, 01:27 PM
The only way I trade Montero for Lee is if an extension is worked out.

Even then its a little bit weary, because Seattle is going to want more.

BTW-You don´t trade when value is low. Montero´s stock is low.

Mark19
06-10-10, 01:34 PM
My source has told me we are close to getting a White Sox reliever.

Oh yeah, Romine and Nunez for Cliff Lee? See ya.

My source says that he would prefer Putz but thinks Tony Pena could have some value as well

jimmykey2
06-10-10, 01:34 PM
Not so sure about that. So far there have been rumors that he offered Montero for BOTH Halladay and Lee.

I think if this one was true, he'd be on the team right now. The second one I don't think is remotely true.

Tifoso
06-10-10, 01:42 PM
Any rumors?

flymick24
06-10-10, 01:44 PM
Was thinking about Linebrink,

but his numbers are bad :/


Jenks hans't been very good either... so maybe his value is low enough to make a decent trade

either one would be a vast improvement over gaudin

just-blaze
06-10-10, 01:53 PM
I think if this one was true, he'd be on the team right now. The second one I don't think is remotely true.

I don´t. It was a one for one. The Blue Jays ended up getting a little more value than just Montero.

jimmykey2
06-10-10, 02:32 PM
I don´t. It was a one for one. The Blue Jays ended up getting a little more value than just Montero.
Who was the last elite player traded for 1 prospect? I doubt that was a serious offer... where did that report come from anyway?

flymick24
06-10-10, 02:34 PM
i think heyman may have reported it in one of those "what went on during the trade" snippets

either way, i could definitely see cash offering montero for halladay 1-1... and if the jays were to bite, than all the more power to cash

Mark19
06-10-10, 04:36 PM
According to Marc Carig - the Yankees have not discussed pursuing anyone, including Lee, at the deadline

MooseDaGun
06-11-10, 08:24 AM
Now that Cervelli has come back down to Earth and the hard-on has subsided, the Yankees would be well served finding a DH.

aeromac76
06-11-10, 08:32 AM
Now that Cervelli has come back down to Earth and the hard-on has subsided, the Yankees would be well served finding a DH.

I concur, at this stage, I look into a big bat and a bullpen arm.
I know that Lee is a top of the rotation guy and that if he gets dealt to somone else they may sign him long term and we've lost him then even in the offseason.
But at this stage, I think we need to focus on a bat and bullpen.
Berkman is perfect for this team, switch hitting monster, DH type. High $$$, so Asros may deal him. I know the Padres are contending, but thery have a monster pen, and Heath Bell is $$$ and they may see a need to deal him for something before they cannot afford him. Sort of like a deal from strength to address something else. Of course, they may want a major league ready hitter, not sure we can offer that, but worth seeing. If not him, look into other places. Wood could be gotten, and while his numbers are bad, it's been just a few bad outings and his stuff is still there. He'd be revitalized in a pennant race too I think.

The pen is a question mark, although everyone there seems to be getting their poop together recently. But the lineup is showing some chinks. Arod not 100%, Po still rounding into shape, NJ gone for a long time. Cervelli being exposed a bit playing every day. Thames is Pujols against lefties, but against righties, I have a better shot to get a hit. Gardner not 100%. You start seeing the lineup not quite be the beast it can be...
Adding that bat could help..

As a matter of fact, Houston is here now, why don;t we just kindly ask them to leave big Lance in town when they leave.

THEBOSS84
06-11-10, 10:35 AM
I would be willing to give up a lot for Matt Thornton. A LOT.

THEBOSS84
06-11-10, 10:37 AM
This is just me offering a scenario -- in other words, this is not from an executive of the Yanks or any other team: I wonder, with Javier Vazquez pitching better, if the Yanks could trade him to an NL team such as the Cardinals, Dodgers or, heck, even Mets and obtain two prospects they know Seattle likes and then package that with one or two of their good prospects such as, say, David Phelps and/or David Adams to get Lee.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yankees/real_cliff_hanger_NZnDENp5ccAMNxIhqpJjfM

This is EXACTLY what I was saying the other day.

EDIT: Here's my post -

http://forums.nyyfans.com/showpost.php?p=6830261&postcount=43

AnA-bombforA-rod
06-11-10, 10:43 AM
http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yankees/real_cliff_hanger_NZnDENp5ccAMNxIhqpJjfM

This is EXACTLY what I was saying the other day.

Oh man I would love that.

flymick24
06-11-10, 02:32 PM
or instead of that, just get berkman and a BP arm

delv
06-11-10, 02:44 PM
we reeaaaaaaaally don't need Lee this year. if we got him, who would we move to the pen come playoff time?

THEBOSS84
06-11-10, 02:47 PM
we reeaaaaaaaally don't need Lee this year. if we got him, who would we move to the pen come playoff time?

CC for the 8th inning. Duhhh

delv
06-11-10, 02:49 PM
given Joe's L/R tendencies, he'd more likely use CC as a LOOGY.

YankeePride1967
06-11-10, 02:49 PM
CC for the 8th inning. Duhhh

Hey, he can affect more games that way than he can as a starter!

ojo
06-11-10, 03:11 PM
we reeaaaaaaaally don't need Lee this year. if we got him, who would we move to the pen come playoff time?

hughes.

lee coming to NYY means Vazquez is dealt to the NL for relief help.

playoff rotation of...

CC
Lee
Pettitte

with Hughes/Joba in the pen and a couple long arms that were had for Vazquez.

that's what appears to perhaps be shaping up anyway...

delv
06-11-10, 03:15 PM
hughes.

lee coming to NYY means Vazquez is dealt to the NL for relief help.

playoff rotation of...

CC
Lee
Pettitte

with Hughes/Joba in the pen and a couple long arms that were had for Vazquez.

that's what appears to perhaps be shaping up anyway...

right... let's put our best pitcher in the pen...........................

http://www.filmhobbit.com/forum/images/admins/smilies/shakehead2.gif

JeterRodriguezSheff
06-11-10, 03:23 PM
The Yankees have no need for Lee right now. The rotation is in excellent shape, and CC hasnt even hit his summer stride yet.

The bullpen is what worries me the most.

DiMaggio5CF
06-11-10, 03:33 PM
I think if this one was true, he'd be on the team right now.

Completely agree. The way I heard it, Montero was the sticking point. If the Yankees had agreed to include Montero, Halladay would have been a Yankee.

NelsonMuntz
06-11-10, 03:52 PM
Now that Cervelli has come back down to Earth and the hard-on has subsided, the Yankees would be well served finding a DH.
Ty Wigginton would make a lot of sense as a DH and possible A-Rod insurance if this groin injury turns out to be more serious. The Orioles are clearly going nowhere anytime soon so they shouldn't have an issue dealing within the division. Alas this is the franchise that loses draft picks by signing mediocre relief pitchers during rebuilding years, so I wouldn't expect Baltimore to do something that actually makes sense.

delv
06-11-10, 03:56 PM
^fyi, if A-Rod goes down, we ain't goin to win the world series either way. Ty Wigginton ain't doin sh** for us.

NelsonMuntz
06-11-10, 03:58 PM
^fyi, if A-Rod goes down, we ain't goin to win the world series either way. Ty Wigginton ain't doin sh** for us.
Well I meant if he had to go on a DL stint, not if he was out the entire season. Clearly I wouldn't want Wigginton at 3B for an extended period of time but he'd be a fine DH and wouldn't be a blackhole like Pena if A-Rod needs to take more days off or DH more frequently to rest his groin.

teknetic
06-11-10, 04:02 PM
http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yankees/real_cliff_hanger_NZnDENp5ccAMNxIhqpJjfM

This is EXACTLY what I was saying the other day.

EDIT: Here's my post -

http://forums.nyyfans.com/showpost.php?p=6830261&postcount=43

I like this. For those saying we don't need a starter because our pitching has been excellent, meh. Pettitte isn't keeping up this pace all year and the injury bug is capable of hitting anyone.

I'll take my chances at throwing out 5 good-excellent starters in the playoffs and then worrying about who gets sent to the pen.

2PhonesMaccabee
06-11-10, 05:26 PM
I like this. For those saying we don't need a starter because our pitching has been excellent, meh. Pettitte isn't keeping up this pace all year and the injury bug is capable of hitting anyone.

I'll take my chances at throwing out 5 good-excellent starters in the playoffs and then worrying about who gets sent to the pen.I would love to have Lee, but we need hitters first and then a bullpen.

TheGameEpisode2
06-11-10, 06:16 PM
Yankees should go after Ty Wigginton; he can play third, second, first and some outfield and has a decent bat and would be nice to put at third while A-Rod DHs. He'd be a huge upgrade over Pena, only problem is that I don't know if the Orioles would trade within the division.

As of backup outfielder...Andruw Jones maybe? Can't really think of anybody right now.

teknetic
06-11-10, 08:35 PM
I would love to have Lee, but we need hitters first and then a bullpen.

Getting Lee won't eliminate the chance to get a decent reliever.

HelloNewman
06-11-10, 10:37 PM
Yankees should go after Ty Wigginton; he can play third, second, first and some outfield and has a decent bat and would be nice to put at third while A-Rod DHs. He'd be a huge upgrade over Pena, only problem is that I don't know if the Orioles would trade within the division.Angelos is spiteful, he will gargle with Drano before he will let MacPhail help the Yankees.

Forget it.

1970cs
06-11-10, 11:59 PM
Apologies if this is posted somewhere else

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100611&content_id=11071018&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

Roy Oswalt?

Mark19
06-14-10, 11:31 AM
As a UTIL/Starter vs. LHP, Jeff Keppinger would fit the bill.

Consistently has an .800 OPS against southpaws and can play all over the diamond, albeit poorly at SS.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 11:34 AM
As a UTIL/Starter vs. LHP, Jeff Keppinger would fit the bill.

Consistently has an .800 OPS against southpaws and can play all over the diamond, albeit poorly at SS.

I was thinking about this yesterday, pretty funny.

JavyVazquezIsSick
06-14-10, 11:37 AM
I like this. For those saying we don't need a starter because our pitching has been excellent, meh. Pettitte isn't keeping up this pace all year and the injury bug is capable of hitting anyone.

I'll take my chances at throwing out 5 good-excellent starters in the playoffs and then worrying about who gets sent to the pen.

Short of Pettitte's arm falling off, he'll get his starts in the PS.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 11:39 AM
The idea is to have a better pitcher pitch a game 2 than Burnett. Sure, we wont it all last year with him doing that. I still would prefer Lee taking the hill over him. Like tek said, Pettitte isn't keeping this up, nor are all of our starters throwing 35 starts a piece.

JavyVazquezIsSick
06-14-10, 11:50 AM
The idea is to have a better pitcher pitch a game 2 than Burnett. Sure, we wont it all last year with him doing that. I still would prefer Lee taking the hill over him. Like tek said, Pettitte isn't keeping this up, nor are all of our starters throwing 35 starts a piece.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see Lee pitch for us, you know this. But Pettitte is getting his starts because of who he is.

And we are paying Burnett what 18m, and he isn't even going to pitch for us. That would be gross.

teknetic
06-14-10, 11:50 AM
Short of Pettitte's arm falling off, he'll get his starts in the PS.

Say wha? I didn't say Pettitte was getting benched for the playoffs.

NYYDragoon
06-14-10, 11:53 AM
The idea is to have a better pitcher pitch a game 2 than Burnett. Sure, we wont it all last year with him doing that. I still would prefer Lee taking the hill over him. Like tek said, Pettitte isn't keeping this up, nor are all of our starters throwing 35 starts a piece.Yeah, so what's the problem?

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 11:56 AM
Yeah, so what's the problem?

That he acted like himself in the playoffs, and dominated the first start only to get demolished in the second. Consistency from your #2 would be swell.

JavyVazquezIsSick
06-14-10, 11:59 AM
Say wha? I didn't say Pettitte was getting benched for the playoffs.

Then Burnett is getting benched?

JOBA RULES
06-14-10, 12:02 PM
Get a bat off the bench or a real DH that doesn't spend half of his baseball career on the DL and away we go.

NYYDragoon
06-14-10, 12:24 PM
That he acted like himself in the playoffs, and dominated the first start only to get demolished in the second. Consistency from your #2 would be swell.Eh?

ALDS Game 2:
6 IP, 3 H, 1 ER, 6 K - Solid

ALCS Game 2:
6.1 IP, 3 H, 2 ER, 4 K - Soild

ALCS Game 5:
6 IP, 8 H, 6 ER, 3 K - Bad start

WS Game 2:
7 IP, 4 H, 1 ER, 9 K - Solid

WS Game 5:
2 IP short rest disaster

All in all I wouldn't call that inconsistency.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 12:26 PM
Eh?

ALDS Game 2:
6 IP, 3 H, 1 ER, 6 K - Solid

ALCS Game 2:
6.1 IP, 3 H, 2 ER, 4 K - Soild

ALCS Game 5:
6 IP, 8 H, 6 ER, 3 K - Bad start

WS Game 2:
7 IP, 4 H, 1 ER, 9 K - Solid

WS Game 5:
2 IP short rest disaster

All in all I wouldn't call that inconsistency.

Obviously I was referring to his ALCS and WS starts. Dominates in his first starts, only to be destroyed in his second. There wasn't a game 2 for him in ALDS...

NYYDragoon
06-14-10, 12:28 PM
Obviously I was referring to his ALCS and WS starts. Dominates in his first starts, only to be destroyed in his second. There wasn't a game 2 for him in ALDS...Again, let's not forget that the second WS start was the short rest gamble.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 12:33 PM
Again, let's not forget that the second WS start was the short rest gamble.

So?

Coming into that game, he had great career #'s on 3 days rest (SSS).

I made the drive to Philly for that game. I'll never forgive him.

NYYDragoon
06-14-10, 12:36 PM
I made the drive to Philly for that game. I'll never forgive him.
Ah. And therein lies the real issue here :P.

I guess I'm just not convinced that Burnett can't pitch to the same club multiple times in a playoff series (which seems to be the conclusion you're hinting at). If we have to make a trade at the deadline I'd much rather it be for a reliever or bench help.

teknetic
06-14-10, 12:38 PM
Then Burnett is getting benched?

Like I said, we're not sure who's gonna be healthy, it wouldn't surprise me if they sat Hughes either.

NYYDragoon
06-14-10, 12:42 PM
Wait a sec. Are you guys assuming we'd go with a 3-man again?

Yankee Tripper
06-14-10, 12:46 PM
Jake Fox was DFA's by Oakland yesterday.

I doubt he clears waivers but I'd like the Yanks to put in a claim.

He'll never be more than passable (if that) defensively but he can "play" LF/RF/3B/1B and most importantly C. With Posada getting a lot of DH time it would be great to have a 3rd catcher on the roster who is a huge upgrade from Chad Moller who could also spell A-rod at 3rd base and not be a clear black hole in the line up like Pena. It would also allow Joe to PH for Cervelli if needed without losing the DH when Posada does DH.

No Fox is never going to be a world beater with AVE but he does have some serious power potential even if he didn't show much of it in Oakland.

Again, I'd be shocked if he cleared waivers - I'm sure some terrible team who needs pop will take a chance on him, KC, Houston, etc.

Mark19
06-14-10, 12:52 PM
Jake Fox was DFA's by Oakland yesterday.

I doubt he clears waivers but I'd like the Yanks to put in a claim.

He'll never be more than passable (if that) defensively but he can "play" LF/RF/3B/1B and most importantly C. With Posada getting a lot of DH time it would be great to have a 3rd catcher on the roster who is a huge upgrade from Chad Moller who could also spell A-rod at 3rd base and not be a clear black hole in the line up like Pena. It would also allow Joe to PH for Cervelli if needed without losing the DH when Posada does DH.

No Fox is never going to be a world beater with AVE but he does have some serious power potential even if he didn't show much of it in Oakland.

Again, I'd be shocked if he cleared waivers - I'm sure some terrible team who needs pop will take a chance on him, KC, Houston, etc.

I second this - we aren't doing Russo any favors by giving him 8 ABs a week and he is limited to 3B,2B and the OF Corners. Fox gives us more positional depth plus some XBH.

delv
06-14-10, 12:59 PM
Jake Fox's ability to catch is nice and all (though he hasn't played more than 13 games at the position since 2006), but if the question here is whether or not Jake Fox is a better option than Russo, I just don't see the benefit, once you take defense and baserunning into account. Also, 1B is not a need.

Plus, Pena has been getting some training at C, for what little it's worth.

Mark19
06-14-10, 01:04 PM
My vote would still be Ryan Doumit

Splitting time between DH/C/1B/RF, he has power and he switch-hits -- plus the Pirates seem to love doing business with us.

Yankee Tripper
06-14-10, 01:09 PM
Jake Fox's ability to catch is nice and all (though he hasn't played more than 13 games at the position since 2006), but if the question here is whether or not Jake Fox is a better option than Russo, I just don't see the benefit, once you take defense and baserunning into account. Also, 1B is not a need.

Plus, Pena has been getting some training at C, for what little it's worth.
Fox has caught several full games this year and doesn't look horrible back there. He also has a decent arm, he hosed Andres Torres who is fast as hell and had a great jump just the other other.

As for power between Russo and Fox, it isn't close, Fox has waaaaay more power than Russo ever will. Russo is better defensively and a better runner but neither of which is a great reason to choose him over Fox. It isn't like Russo has Golson like speed or a Pena type glove, he's average to slightly above average at best with the glove or on base paths. Also Russo doesn't look great in the OF when he plays, he looks like an IF playing outfield which is what he is.

As for 1B, yeah that doesn't matter at all, I was just mentioning it as a position Fox plays, his value comes from being a 3rd C, a back up 3B and a power bat off the bench and a 4th/5th OF type.

I happen to think he'd be an upgrade over Russo, due mostly to the C ability but even without the C ability I see Fox as possessing 25 HR power than Russo will never have. Russo's value would be to some one who use a .280 hitting line drive 2B, which is something the Yanks don't really need with Cano manning 2B for the forseeable future.

Kluivert4Ever
06-14-10, 02:01 PM
Eh?

ALDS Game 2:
6 IP, 3 H, 1 ER, 6 K - Solid

ALCS Game 2:
6.1 IP, 3 H, 2 ER, 4 K - Soild

ALCS Game 5:
6 IP, 8 H, 6 ER, 3 K - Bad start

WS Game 2:
7 IP, 4 H, 1 ER, 9 K - Solid

WS Game 5:
2 IP short rest disaster

All in all I wouldn't call that inconsistency.

Actually, I would. If you pitch 3 good games out of 5 thats pitching well in 60 % of your games and that is the model of inconsistency IMO.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 02:15 PM
On the pitching side of things, don't be surprised if a contender with sabermetric leanings makes a run at Chad Qualls. With an 8.46 ERA, you'd think he'd been a total disaster, but his xFIP is a respectable 3.55, and he's been one of the best relievers in the league the last few years. His .474 BABIP will regress, and he could be a quality bullpen piece for another team down the stretch. A free agent at the end of the year, you have to think that his days in Arizona are numbered whether he's traded or not, so Arizona will likely be happy to move him. Don't be surprised if he's involved in a "change of scenery" trade.

http://www.fangraphs.com/

He can probably be had for nothing...

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 02:21 PM
So...

Dan Haren...I like.

Mark19
06-14-10, 02:22 PM
Heh, the Cubs are rumored to be interested in dropping Xavier Nady - maybe continue with the reunion theme?

NYYDragoon
06-14-10, 02:24 PM
So...

Dan Haren...I like.Dan Haren...I love.

EDIT: But whoa, what's his deal this season?

Don_Veto
06-14-10, 02:37 PM
Has anyone in this thread mentioned Berkman? Probably wouldn't cost a lot in terms of prospects. In the last year of his deal. As long as picking up his club option for next year isn't mandatory when making a trade, it sounds like a good fit.

Yankee Tripper
06-14-10, 02:38 PM
Dan Haren...I love.

EDIT: But whoa, what's his deal this season?too many of his fly balls are leaving the yard.

I too would be all over grabbing Haren, even with his post ASB splits but I think trading for him this year, like Lee before the trading dead line doesn't make a whole lotta sense, barring an injury to one of the 5 existing starters.

Mark19
06-14-10, 02:39 PM
Has anyone in this thread mentioned Berkman? Probably wouldn't cost a lot in terms of prospects. In the last year of his deal. As long as picking up his club option for next year isn't mandatory when making a trade, it sounds like a good fit.

He is still owed a lot of money and to accommodate him we'd basically have to cut Nick Johnson when he returns from the DL as well as curtail the playing time for both Posada and Cervelli.

His numbers aren't blowing me away and I don't see it being just a salary dump either - they'll want an interesting prospect or two.

fredgmuggs
06-14-10, 02:41 PM
He is still owed a lot of money and to accommodate him we'd basically have to cut Nick Johnson when he returns from the DL as well as curtail the playing time for both Posada and Cervelli.

His numbers aren't blowing me away and I don't see it being just a salary dump either - they'll want an interesting prospect or two.
I'll be amazed if Nick Johnson returns this season.

Kluivert4Ever
06-14-10, 02:50 PM
Heh, the Cubs are rumored to be interested in dropping Xavier Nady - maybe continue with the reunion theme?

I would give him a shot.

I'm A Wenner!
06-14-10, 02:54 PM
He is still owed a lot of money and to accommodate him we'd basically have to cut Nick Johnson when he returns from the DL as well as curtail the playing time for both Posada and Cervelli.

His numbers aren't blowing me away and I don't see it being just a salary dump either - they'll want an interesting prospect or two.

That will be a salary dump. There is absolutely no reason to think otherwise.

teknetic
06-14-10, 03:06 PM
Wait a sec. Are you guys assuming we'd go with a 3-man again?

Sabathia, AJ, Pettitte, Lee/Vasquez

Don_Veto
06-14-10, 03:06 PM
Sabathia, AJ, Pettitte, Lee/Vasquez

Phil Hughes disappeared?

Mark19
06-14-10, 03:07 PM
That will be a salary dump. There is absolutely no reason to think otherwise.

He's been a big part of that organization for over a decade - I imagine they'll want something of value in return.

Besides, I'm sure we can find a cheaper, complementary player who can out-OPS him while being able to play elsewhere in the field.

teknetic
06-14-10, 03:32 PM
Phil Hughes disappeared?

Try and read the last page.

I'm A Wenner!
06-14-10, 03:35 PM
He's been a big part of that organization for over a decade - I imagine they'll want something of value in return.

Besides, I'm sure we can find a cheaper, complementary player who can out-OPS him while being able to play elsewhere in the field.

They'll want to not pay his salary anymore. That's what they'll get.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 03:37 PM
They'll want to not pay his salary anymore. That's what they'll get.

What do they call that again?

Mark19
06-14-10, 03:45 PM
They'll want to not pay his salary anymore. That's what they'll get.

I disagree, I imagine they will also want some talent. It may only be a B prospect or a AAA pitcher but I don't think they'll be able to sell their remaining fans on the idea of dumping the face of their team for $10 million in savings.

R.V.47
06-14-10, 04:05 PM
He's been a big part of that organization for over a decade - I imagine they'll want something of value in return.

Besides, I'm sure we can find a cheaper, complementary player who can out-OPS him while being able to play elsewhere in the field.

Bobby Abreu was a big part of the Phillies for over a decade and he got salary dumped. First part of rebuilding is getting rid of the dead weight on the payroll and creating a new face for the organization. Definitly worked for the Phillies thats for sure.

I agree though with your second point, Im not sure if the yankees need to put themselves in a position where they will have to pay Berkmans large salary next year just because we have a hole at DH now. There could be other options.

Yankee Tripper
06-14-10, 04:07 PM
Bobby Abreu was a big part of the Phillies for over a decade and he got salary dumped. First part of rebuilding is getting rid of the dead weight on the payroll and creating a new face for the organization. Definitly worked for the Phillies thats for sure.

I agree though with your second point, Im not sure if the yankees need to put themselves in a position where they will have to pay Berkmans large salary next year just because we have a hole at DH now. There could be other options.

I think part of the orginal condition was not picking up Berkman's option. But still I agree the big Puma doesn't make a whole lotta sense.

Mark19
06-14-10, 04:10 PM
Bobby Abreu was a big part of the Phillies for over a decade and he got salary dumped. First part of rebuilding is getting rid of the dead weight on the payroll and creating a new face for the organization. Definitly worked for the Phillies thats for sure.

I agree though with your second point, Im not sure if the yankees need to put themselves in a position where they will have to pay Berkmans large salary next year just because we have a hole at DH now. There could be other options.

We gave the Phillies CJ Henry, Carlos Monasterios and Matt Smith - nothing eye-popping but combine it with taking on Lidle's salary and you have something easier for the fanbase to stomach.

Besides, Philly fans were griping and moaning about Abreu for years, I think they still genuinely like Berkman in Houston.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 04:11 PM
No team is trading for Berkman and picking up his option next year. It's not realistic.

MooseDaGun
06-14-10, 04:18 PM
Heh, the Cubs are rumored to be interested in dropping Xavier Nady - maybe continue with the reunion theme?
He's probably the best option out there right now.

delv
06-14-10, 04:34 PM
He's probably the best option out there right now.

gross. what purpose would he serve that Thames, upon his return, wouldn't? Nady is caca

R.V.47
06-14-10, 04:37 PM
We gave the Phillies CJ Henry, Carlos Monasterios and Matt Smith - nothing eye-popping but combine it with taking on Lidle's salary and you have something easier for the fanbase to stomach.

Besides, Philly fans were griping and moaning about Abreu for years, I think they still genuinely like Berkman in Houston.

True Philly fans were moaning about Abreu for years but he was still one of their best players by far the reason fans tired of him there was they didnt like his laid back attitude and thought as the face of the team he shouldve been a more vocal leader. The kinds of ridiculous complains you expect form Philly fans I guess.

My point is Berkman being the face of the Astros doesnt mean anything when it comes to trade talks. Its business.

MooseDaGun
06-14-10, 04:40 PM
gross. what purpose would he serve that Thames, upon his return, wouldn't? Nady is caca
The same .800ish OPS without being a total liability in the field? I guess if we're talking strictly DH then they're interchangeable, but I'm sure Girardi has to make decisions based on the fact that Thames is pretty awful in the outfield.

coachtsurfing
06-14-10, 04:58 PM
I'll be amazed if Nick Johnson returns this season.

Anyone notice how Matsui doing???

HelloNewman
06-14-10, 05:11 PM
Anyone notice how Matsui doing???Uh oh, now you did it. :lol:

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 05:12 PM
Anyone notice how Matsui doing???

No, the members on this site only bring him up when he's doing poorly.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 05:14 PM
A source tells Craig Calcaterra of NBC Sports that the Rangers are "getting closer" to acquiring Roy Oswalt from the Astros.
The major hurdle, of course, is that the financially-strapped Rangers are trying to convince Major League Baseball to allow them to take on Oswalt's salary. The players "are more or less agreed to," according to Calcaterra. Oswalt is still a major financial commitment, so it shouldn't be assumed that Major League Baseball will see it their way.

Rotoworld -

Mark19
06-14-10, 05:21 PM
Rotoworld -

Hmm, I wonder who is going back to Houston?

Arias? maybe Max Ramirez?

delv
06-14-10, 05:30 PM
Man, the Rangers have so many young starting pitchers, too; too many, even. Surely an arm is going back to Houston.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 05:33 PM
Buster just shot the rumor down - "nothing to it".

Dexter Morgan
06-14-10, 06:10 PM
Would anyone be interested in bringing in Xavier Nady for a bench spot? He could also get some starts vs. some LHP.

teknetic
06-14-10, 06:11 PM
Redundancy.

Dexter Morgan
06-14-10, 06:15 PM
Well we need someone for the bench. Cervelli, Thames (now Huffmann), Pena, and Russo is a BAD bench. We need some vetarns who can handle sittin on the bench for 2 weeks and get a hit when giving the opportunity (like a Hinske and Hairston)

Dexter Morgan
06-14-10, 06:20 PM
Another guy I'm interested in:

Ty Wigginton.

teknetic
06-14-10, 06:53 PM
I want Luke Scott. But its not happening.

Mark19
06-14-10, 06:57 PM
I want Luke Scott. But its not happening.

Russell Branyan could probably put up similar numbers while subbing at 4 positions - albeit poorly

Mark19
06-14-10, 07:01 PM
I want Luke Scott. But its not happening.

or better yet, see what the Royals want for Kila Ka'aihue

jesterno2
06-14-10, 07:09 PM
We gave the Phillies CJ Henry, Carlos Monasterios and Matt Smith - nothing eye-popping but combine it with taking on Lidle's salary and you have something easier for the fanbase to stomach.

Besides, Philly fans were griping and moaning about Abreu for years, I think they still genuinely like Berkman in Houston.

Actually, IIRC (and I'm almost positive about this) Cash Money wouldn't pull the trigger on the deal unless it included Lidle, not the other way around. I forget the reasoning, I think it was a hole in the back of the rotation, but I think Cashman said he wouldn't take all of Abeu's salary for all those prospects (including a 1st rounder albeit one we didn't want anymore) unless the Phillies threw in Lidle.

With the way things worked out it looked like highway robbery with what Abreu brought in his time here, the contributions Lidle made getting us to the playoffs (almost definitely would've been resigned if he hadn't passed away), and getting Henry back later.

coachtsurfing
06-14-10, 07:51 PM
No, the members on this site only bring him up when he's doing poorly.

lol, i know i shouldn't have posted that. but he is doing well. I'm glad for him. I still wish we had him. but we don't so, we do need another dh.

BobLoblaw
06-14-10, 08:02 PM
No, the members on this site only bring him up when he's doing poorly.

lol, so true.

False1
06-14-10, 08:19 PM
Russell Branyan could probably put up similar numbers while subbing at 4 positions - albeit poorlyI proposed another Indian a week or two ago... what about Austin Kearns? Seems to be in a (at least temporary) offensive renaissance, on a 1/$750k deal, can soak up some OF/DH at bats. Wonder what Cleveland would want for him given that he costs so little.

False1
06-14-10, 08:30 PM
http://www.fangraphs.com/

He can probably be had for nothing...Yep, posted my vote in the "reliever we're targeting" thread about 2 weeks ago. Could probably have him for a song.

http://forums.nyyfans.com/showpost.php?p=6818994&postcount=45

R.V.47
06-14-10, 08:51 PM
I proposed another Indian a week or two ago... what about Austin Kearns? Seems to be in a (at least temporary) offensive renaissance, on a 1/$750k deal, can soak up some OF/DH at bats. Wonder what Cleveland would want for him given that he costs so little.

Kearns is a little more versatile and less 1 dimensional than Branyan so I like that. But having a left handed bat like Branyan off the bench and DHing some days is kind of intriguing. It reminds me of Strawberry in 98, where Joe Torre basically just told him to go grab a bat and hit a home run and he do it.

Huktonfonix
06-14-10, 09:09 PM
Since I've posted it in umpteen other threads over the past year and a half, I'll say it again here. Ryan Doumit is a perfect fit in that he adds versatility and pop and can likely be had for someone like Z-Mac. He's a poor man's Posada that can also play 1B and the corners.

THEBOSS84
06-14-10, 09:29 PM
Since I've posted it in umpteen other threads over the past year and a half, I'll say it again here. Ryan Doumit is a perfect fit in that he adds versatility and pop and can likely be had for someone like Z-Mac. He's a poor man's Posada that can also play 1B and the corners.

I'm very in. I'm too lazy to check out his contract situation right now, though. Would it make sense for the Pirates to dump him at this point in time?

TheInfallibleOne
06-14-10, 09:29 PM
Since I've posted it in umpteen other threads over the past year and a half, I'll say it again here. Ryan Doumit is a perfect fit in that he adds versatility and pop and can likely be had for someone like Z-Mac. He's a poor man's Posada that can also play 1B and the corners.


Except hes already the pirates starting catcher and is signed to a very reasonable contract. He has an interesting clause that makes his 2012 and 2013 years an optional extension to be exercised immediately after the 2011 season, and he will be paid about 20 million from 2011-2013 if exercised. 5.1 million in 2011 with a 500K buyout for the extension years. I'm not so sure the Pirates are itching to dump that.

Also, I'm wondering why he's been in the majors since 2005 and still has yet to play more than 116 games. Is he an injury risk?

Overall I think Huntington would ask for more than Cashman is willing to pay in prospects, especially since we are already flush with catching prospects.

5OClockLighting
06-14-10, 09:52 PM
It reminds me of Strawberry in 98, where Joe Torre basically just told him to go grab a bat and hit a home run and he do it.Worked for Mr. Burns too.

I'm A Wenner!
06-14-10, 09:59 PM
Darryl Strawberry pinch-hit 7 times in 1998.

Dexter Morgan
06-14-10, 10:51 PM
Ryan Doumit's contract....

10:$3.55M, 11:$5.1M, 12:$7.25M club option, 13:$8.25M club option ($0.5M buyout)

TheInfallibleOne
06-14-10, 10:53 PM
Ryan Doumit's contract....

10:$3.55M, 11:$5.1M, 12:$7.25M club option, 13:$8.25M club option ($0.5M buyout)

Yes, but the '12 and '13 options have to be exercised by the end of '11 as a package deal.

flymick24
06-14-10, 11:40 PM
doumit is definitely going to be traded at the deadline... they'll probably play jaramillo every day until next season, when tony sanchez gets promoted prematurely

ace
06-15-10, 11:54 AM
Kearns is a little more versatile and less 1 dimensional than Branyan so I like that. But having a left handed bat like Branyan off the bench and DHing some days is kind of intriguing. It reminds me of Strawberry in 92, where Mr. Burns basically just told him to go grab a bat and hit a home run and he do it.

Fixed.

"I told him to do that"
"Brilliant strategy, sir"

ace
06-15-10, 11:57 AM
Worked for Mr. Burns too.

Didn't realize you beat me to it already.

THEBOSS84
06-15-10, 12:10 PM
"Cliff Lee's trade value"

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/cliff-lees-trade-value/

Yankee Fan in Boston
06-15-10, 12:17 PM
"Cliff Lee's trade value"

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/cliff-lees-trade-value/

What I don't like about that analysis is, after talking about how each team has more info than they did in December, and that they can better determine Lee's value, he then compares Lee to a generic replacement level pitcher. The reality, however, is that each team is in a different situation,and Lee's value is different to each -- if the Yankees got Lee, for instance, he's replacing (assuming no injuries)... Vazquez? Assuming Vazquez is more the guy we are seeing now then the guy we saw in April, it changes the equation.

JSG
06-15-10, 12:42 PM
Wait a sec. Are you guys assuming we'd go with a 3-man again?

yeah, 3-man won't work this yr w a few less off days.

jesterno2
06-15-10, 01:17 PM
Since I've posted it in umpteen other threads over the past year and a half, I'll say it again here. Ryan Doumit is a perfect fit in that he adds versatility and pop and can likely be had for someone like Z-Mac. He's a poor man's Posada that can also play 1B and the corners.

no way in hell i'd give up zmac for doumit when he could probably be had for a package of lesser prospects. zmac is one of our top 5 prospects and has a legit change to be an inning eating middle to back of the rotation starter. he's done nothing but produce and move up the system and he'll be cost controlled. especially with that contract progression i wouldn't want to give up a ton for doumit, although i agree that he could be a very versatile piece.

flymick24
06-15-10, 01:40 PM
he's facing a little adversity in AAA right now, as his stuff isn't really translating as well to the upper levels... the lack of a true outpitch is coming back to bite him, and he isn't getting nearly as many GB's

i wouldn't be surprised if he and some other attractive pieces in AAA (nunez, romulo, and maybe even melancon) are made available for a DH bat

ppa79
06-15-10, 01:45 PM
he's facing a little adversity in AAA right now, as his stuff isn't really translating as well to the upper levels... the lack of a true outpitch is coming back to bite him, and he isn't getting nearly as many GB's

i wouldn't be surprised if he and some other attractive pieces in AAA (nunez, romulo, and maybe even melancon) are made available for a DH bat

I wouldn't give up Melancon. Good Stuff, good command, and good minor league track record. I think he will be a good reliever.

flymick24
06-15-10, 01:47 PM
i personally have not... but with the way the FO is handling him, i wouldn't be surprised if they use him in a deal

R.V.47
06-15-10, 01:47 PM
I was happy to read today that the yankees have not shown interest in Kosuke Fukudome. Yet another bad signing trying to be undone by the Cubs.

delv
06-15-10, 02:44 PM
I was happy to read today that the yankees have not shown interest in Kosuke Fukudome. Yet another bad signing trying to be undone by the Cubs.

Fukudome is a strange fellow. The amount he was signed for is no doubt horrific, but he's not as bad as it may seem. He has largely fulfilled his billing as a less-slugging J.D. Drew, but his conditioning must really be poor. He consistently puts up a .335/.446/.558 line in April, slowly decreases in productivity til he's putting up .213/.319/.315 levels in June or so, surges back up in July to .271/.350/.458 and then sleep-walks through August and September. Accordingly, he'd be a horrible trade deadline candidate.

mal1219
06-15-10, 03:19 PM
A's just stole Conor Jackson from the D-backs for a minor league pitcher:

http://newyork.yankees.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100615&content_id=11193576&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

Remember him being mentioned as a trade target for Cash. Don't care if he is only hitting .238 with 1 HR, he has quite a nice swing and could be a contributing player (even with "only" a 109 OPS+ in June). Don't get why the D-backs would trade him now, he has just started hitting (.289 batting average in June, albeit after a horrible May).

THEBOSS84
06-15-10, 03:21 PM
A's just stole Conor Jackson from the D-backs for a minor league pitcher:

http://newyork.yankees.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100615&content_id=11193576&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

Remember him being mentioned as a trade target for Cash. Don't care if he is only hitting .238 with 1 HR, he has quite a nice swing and could be a contributing player (even with "only" a 109 OPS+ in June). Don't get why the D-backs would trade him now, he has just started hitting (.289 batting average in June, albeit after a horrible May).

Yeah, it's pretty upsetting. A .356 career OBP and that's including his sub-par years this year and last.

Axon
06-15-10, 04:04 PM
Bring me Stephen Strasburg

TheHugeUnit2
06-15-10, 04:12 PM
Yeah, it's pretty upsetting. A .356 career OBP and that's including his sub-par years this year and last.
I wanted to cry when I saw that trade. I mean Romulo Sanchez could of gotten us Conor Jackson.

Yankee Tripper
06-15-10, 04:43 PM
A's just stole Conor Jackson from the D-backs for a minor league pitcher:
.
That's what I thought at first but it wouldn't surprise me if Sam Demel is closing for the D-back before to long. Qualls is toxic, Gutierrez blew up in his chance and Heilman doesn't really profile as a closer. Demel was a 3rd round pick and college closer and he's putting up good numbers while closing in Sacramento this year.

ojo
06-15-10, 10:23 PM
if chris young (OF, AZ) is available...um...yes please.

THEBOSS84
06-15-10, 10:34 PM
if chris young (OF, AZ) is available...um...yes please.

I don't like him much (good season so far), but I'd like to know what you'd do with him?

Huktonfonix
06-15-10, 11:11 PM
Except hes already the pirates starting catcher and is signed to a very reasonable contract. He has an interesting clause that makes his 2012 and 2013 years an optional extension to be exercised immediately after the 2011 season, and he will be paid about 20 million from 2011-2013 if exercised. 5.1 million in 2011 with a 500K buyout for the extension years. I'm not so sure the Pirates are itching to dump that.

Also, I'm wondering why he's been in the majors since 2005 and still has yet to play more than 116 games. Is he an injury risk?

Overall I think Huntington would ask for more than Cashman is willing to pay in prospects, especially since we are already flush with catching prospects.

Meant to reply to this and THEBOSS84 earlier, but it's been a busy day at work, what with world cup and yanks/phils games to watch.

Doumit's contract is reasonable, but he offers no value to the pirates. He's got a year and a half left on his deal (no way they pick up the option), so he doesn't factor into the Pirates' rebuilding plan and he's blocking their second best (position) prospect. Sanchez is nowhere near ready, but he's most likely their future. Even if he's not, it's not Doumit. And reasonable or not, 5.1 million is a LOT for the Pirates to spend. He and Duke are gone at the deadline for sure (and rightly so).

As for your injury question, in a word, yes. He's known as "Mr. Glass" 'round these parts. That's one of the reasons his trade value is nowhere near what you think it is. That and his other nickname is "No Mitt." A healthy catcher with his bat, his age, and his contract would command a king's ransom. One with his injury history and defensive struggles could be had for Z-Mac.

Some of it is fluke injuries (concussion this year) but he's also had wrist problems that made him largely ineffective last season. He's not a guy you'd want to get into bed with long term, but the Yankees are a uniquely good fit in that they don't require a 120 game catcher. He and Posada could share time between DH and C, keeping them both from wearing down and giving them two + bats in the lineup most days with plenty of AB's left over for Cervelli (especially when you figure doumit can play lf/rf/1b too).

False1
06-16-10, 02:09 AM
if chris young (OF, AZ) is available...um...yes please.I tossed this out there prior to the Granderson acquisition, but his contract is horrible and our outfield is pretty set at the moment. Unless they're eating enough of that contract to enable him to be a reasonably priced 4th OF, I'd pass. AZ does have some peices that could be fits for our bullpen, however.

mal1219
06-16-10, 02:35 AM
That's what I thought at first but it wouldn't surprise me if Sam Demel is closing for the D-back before to long. Qualls is toxic, Gutierrez blew up in his chance and Heilman doesn't really profile as a closer. Demel was a 3rd round pick and college closer and he's putting up good numbers while closing in Sacramento this year.

Saw this posted somewhere else on Qualls:

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/what-the-arizona-diamondbacks-should-do/


On the pitching side of things, don’t be surprised if a contender with sabermetric leanings makes a run at Chad Qualls (http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=2170&position=P). With an 8.46 ERA, you’d think he’d been a total disaster, but his xFIP is a respectable 3.55, and he’s been one of the best relievers in the league the last few years. His .474 BABIP will regress, and he could be a quality bullpen piece for another team down the stretch. A free agent at the end of the year, you have to think that his days in Arizona are numbered whether he’s traded or not, so Arizona will likely be happy to move him. Don’t be surprised if he’s involved in a “change of scenery” trade.

Walks are up, but so are strikeouts, his BABIP is very high at .450 and his WHIP is over 2. FIP at 4.14 and xFIP 3.56.

I'm not a sabermetrics expert at all, but it seems like he is "just" having some bad luck. Also, do they not indicate a bad defence behind him. If so, I wouldn't mind making a run at him, if ARI wants to trade him (we'll throw in Boone Logan for free).

coachtsurfing
06-16-10, 07:20 AM
it wouldn't hurt to find a dh that can also play 3rd. Pena is terrible.

NelsonMuntz
06-16-10, 11:24 AM
it wouldn't hurt to find a dh that can also play 3rd. Pena is terrible.
Ty Wigginton would fit that bill, albeit his defense at third might be questionable and I'm skeptical that Angelos would deal him to the Yankees for anything reasonable.

JOBA RULES
06-16-10, 11:35 AM
it wouldn't hurt to find a dh that can also play 3rd. Pena is terrible.

he's got a good glove but the .208 avg is not a threat you want to PH with off the bench. I wouldn't say he's terrible he's just weak with the bat.

Yankee Tripper
06-16-10, 11:36 AM
Saw this posted somewhere else on Qualls:

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/what-the-arizona-diamondbacks-should-do/



Walks are up, but so are strikeouts, his BABIP is very high at .450 and his WHIP is over 2. FIP at 4.14 and xFIP 3.56.

I'm not a sabermetrics expert at all, but it seems like he is "just" having some bad luck. Also, do they not indicate a bad defence behind him. If so, I wouldn't mind making a run at him, if ARI wants to trade him (we'll throw in Boone Logan for free).Qualls would do well to get a change of scenery but I'd be schocked to see him turn it around closing in AZ. He might even get confidence in AZ in low leverage situations but he's been a total disater so far, I don't care what FIP & xFIP say.