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View Full Version : Buy low on Erik Bedard



Abe Frohman
11-23-08, 06:52 PM
Because of his minor set back, i think we've been sleeping on this guy. I think this is exactly the kind of
unexpected move that Cashman would and should make. Getting Bedard in pinstripes won't cost as much
as some others prospects-wise and i feel like Seattle is down on him with all the rumors floating that he
doesn't want to be there. Along with CC and Bedard back to Orioles form, we'd have the best rotation
in all of Baseball, by a wide margin.

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=MLB&id=3449 (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=MLB&id=3449)

THEBOSS84
11-23-08, 06:54 PM
I'd be interested depending on his cost.

nnysiny
11-23-08, 06:55 PM
hes a clubhouse cancer and has almost no chance of going 200 innings. he would have to be really cheap

Abe Frohman
11-23-08, 07:20 PM
hes a clubhouse cancer and has almost no chance of going 200 innings. he would have to be really cheap

What would you guys consider cheap ? Our most expendable blue chipper and a few
other B or C prospects ? Seattle would probably rather the prospects than a player
who has no interest in succeeding for their club.

NYYDragoon
11-23-08, 07:21 PM
hes a clubhouse cancer and has almost no chance of going 200 innings. he would have to be really cheapYeah. Doesn't he hate pitching or something?

bigjf
11-23-08, 07:31 PM
He's had success in the AL East before. I'd love to buy low on him, but this is the same team who asked for prospects in exchange for dumping Washburn's contract. I sincerely doubt we could get Bedard at anything fair.

nnysiny
11-23-08, 07:32 PM
What would you guys consider cheap ? Our most expendable blue chipper and a few
other B or C prospects ? Seattle would probably rather the prospects than a player
who has no interest in succeeding for their club.
i think Bedard is a FA agent after this year. i would not give up anything significant (if this is true)

dont_ya_know24
11-23-08, 07:38 PM
He's had success in the AL East before. I'd love to buy low on him, but this is the same team who asked for prospects in exchange for dumping Washburn's contract. I sincerely doubt we could get Bedard at anything fair.

different GM

Melan-cynic
11-23-08, 07:50 PM
If you thought Peavy didn't want to come to NY, Bedard is much, much worse. Apparently the guy goes beyond "private" and abhors talking to the media and interacting with fans. Could you imagine the guy facing the NY media? It'd be like Private Pile wigging out in Full Metal Jacket.

Billy Ball 2008
11-23-08, 07:51 PM
If you thought Peavy didn't want to come to NY, Bedard is much, much worse. Apparently the guy goes beyond "private" and abhors talking to the media and interacting with fans. Could you imagine the guy facing the NY media? It'd be like Private Pile wigging out in Full Metal Jacket.

:lol:

Melan-cynic
11-23-08, 07:52 PM
Love his talent and upside, but his shoulder injury is scary. It isn't unreasonable to believe his stuff never comes back to where it was pre-surgery. His FB becomes average and curveball less of a weapon. Not to mention an inability to log innings. I think reclamation projects are fun to think of, but only once the rotation is set and not before.

NYYFutures17
11-23-08, 08:16 PM
He's decent enough when he's healthy. But, we're talking about a guy who is more injury prone than A.J. Burnett. Plus, Seattle had to give up a truckload of decent prospects to get him, including Adam Jones. They're going to want similar value to what they gave up to get him, and I'd be amazed if they'd be stupid enough to take any less. Bedard isn't going anywhere unless they lose some major brain cellage up in Seattle.

Roberto Kelly
11-23-08, 09:55 PM
hes a clubhouse cancer and has almost no chance of going 200 innings. he would have to be really cheap

I heard those same rumblings about him

Melan-cynic
11-23-08, 10:51 PM
I heard those same rumblings about him

Count me in as well. Heyman reported that on FAN recently, and he was blatant regarding Bedard's tendency as a clubhouse cancer. IIRC, Heyman went as far as calling Bedard "a loser," which is a strong statement, particularly from a solid writer like him.

bigjf
11-24-08, 12:38 AM
different GM

Good point, as long as that means the FO is going to change their philosophy a bit. It also doesn't mean Bedard would come cheap. Different GM, yeah, but Seattle isn't going to forget how much they gave up for Bedard in the first place. Maybe they don't get as much back, but they're going to want a decent package in return and rightfully so.

BonusCantos
11-24-08, 12:51 AM
Count me in as well. Heyman reported that on FAN recently, and he was blatant regarding Bedard's tendency as a clubhouse cancer. IIRC, Heyman went as far as calling Bedard "a loser," which is a strong statement, particularly from a solid writer like him.I had not heard any of this, but if your reporting is accurate, that's interesting.

I did a little link searching and I came up with this article entitled "Bedard a jerk worth keeping": http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/baseball/371978_moore24.html

mrmike98
11-24-08, 06:32 AM
Bedard should be avoided. (Arm and attitude)

flymick24
11-24-08, 06:42 AM
he should just go back to canada and hunt moose

R.V.47
11-24-08, 07:50 AM
It makes no sense for the Mariners to trade him right now. They wont come close to the value they had to give up to get him in return. Unless Bedard is demanding a trade, I dont see it happening.

NYDCYankee
11-24-08, 08:59 AM
Swisher or Nady and Kennedy for Bedard.

wang+cano=future
11-24-08, 10:22 AM
He also will be a FA after 2009.

Pat2390
11-24-08, 11:29 AM
Considering his free agency is upcoming and Sea cant get near same value in return as to what they gave up, I forsee see himstaying put until All Star Break.

nnysiny
11-24-08, 11:33 AM
Swisher or Nady and Kennedy for Bedard.
good lord, i hope not. i wouldnt give them any of those straight up for an impending FA

Melan-cynic
11-24-08, 11:45 AM
I had not heard any of this, but if your reporting is accurate, that's interesting.

I did a little link searching and I came up with this article entitled "Bedard a jerk worth keeping": http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/baseball/371978_moore24.html

I'm not sure if Heyman wrote a corresponding article for SI.com, but I know for a fact he said that on WFAN with Fatso.

ajra21
11-24-08, 11:58 AM
no reason to do this. he doesn't like baseball. can you imagine him in NY?

Prison Mike
11-24-08, 11:59 AM
Shoulder problems and impending free agency? Unless we're giving up next to nothing, I want no part of him.

Pat2390
11-24-08, 01:10 PM
Shoulder problems and impending free agency? Unless we're giving up next to nothing, I want no part of him. Well Said jailbird

Blazer
11-24-08, 04:42 PM
Shoulder problems and impending free agency? Unless we're giving up next to nothing, I want no part of him.

And to make matters worse, those shoulder problems involve the labrum.

YankeePride1967
11-24-08, 05:02 PM
After what the Mariners gave up to get Bedard. I think it will be quite some time for the price to be low enough for me to be interested.

ajra21
11-25-08, 09:53 AM
After what the Mariners gave up to get Bedard. I think it will be quite some time for the price to be low enough for me to be interested.

that was such a bad trade for seattle.

cyhughes22
11-25-08, 09:55 AM
He's an awful clubhouse guy coming off of an awful injury plagued season. Plus do you remember how much Seattle wanted for Washburn even though they knew they were going nowhere. Not going to happen and thank god for that. Now if we could somehow pry that Morrow kid away from them :drool: but of course that's a pipe dream.

JohnnyDamonfan
11-25-08, 09:58 AM
DO you think we could get him for Mely and a prospect or two?

cyhughes22
11-25-08, 10:04 AM
DO you think we could get him for Mely and a prospect or two?

It would depend on the prospect and he's not worth any of our good ones. Seattle would ask for a lot even though he sucks and there would be no reason to do it. Unless it was for Melky, Igawa and Kennedy Cashman would deserve to be fired immediately if he traded for this loser.

JohnnyDamonfan
11-25-08, 10:48 AM
It would depend on the prospect and he's not worth any of our good ones. Seattle would ask for a lot even though he sucks and there would be no reason to do it. Unless it was for Melky, Igawa and Kennedy Cashman would deserve to be fired immediately if he traded for this loser.

I don't even know Kennedy how about Melky, Igawa, and Shelley Duncan? (Shelley Duncan is my boy but if it helps get Bedard I''d do it.) Other then that no thanks.

35Knucklecurve
11-25-08, 12:36 PM
If you thought Peavy didn't want to come to NY, Bedard is much, much worse. Apparently the guy goes beyond "private" and abhors talking to the media and interacting with fans. Could you imagine the guy facing the NY media? It'd be like Private Pile wigging out in Full Metal Jacket.
Kevin Brown and RJ, the sequels.....only younger.

aeromac76
11-25-08, 12:38 PM
If you can get him for nothing, his talent makes him worth a decent look.
But if the Mariners ask for anything of note, walk away..

DaSh 1s
11-25-08, 12:44 PM
I dont understand why you guys want to trade for him? Isn't he missing a portion of the year because of shoulder surgery? So we should trade for him let him rehab during the second half of the season to become a free agent?

Tsk Tsk, pathetic on his part. With the Amount of Money pitchers like Burnett and Lowe are going to make this winter, he would have been in line to make a killing.

yanksphan
11-25-08, 12:54 PM
Swisher or Nady and Kennedy for Bedard.

No way. Melky and Igawa is more like it.

nnysiny
11-25-08, 05:04 PM
DO you think we could get him for Mely and a prospect or two?
doubt it, but Melky and a B prospect would be the only way i would do it

Metroidman
11-25-08, 05:16 PM
He's gonna be worth 2 picks

You aren't gonna get him for trash

flymick24
11-25-08, 11:56 PM
the last thing this team needs is an a-hole to go in there and ruin what little chemistry is left after the yankees traded for a-rod :D

just-blaze
11-27-08, 01:37 PM
He's gonna be worth 2 picks

You aren't gonna get him for trash

That might have been true a couple of years ago, but that is looking borderline right now.

Which is why the Mariners would possible take a little more than trash for him.

FWIW-You could have said the same about Bobby Abreu.

hockeypuck2008
11-27-08, 02:40 PM
That might have been true a couple of years ago, but that is looking borderline right now.

Which is why the Mariners would possible take a little more than trash for him.

FWIW-You could have said the same about Bobby Abreu.

Let's be honest here, they traded a ................load for him just last winter. Why, despite his injuries and pending free agency, would they trade him now? If you owned him, would you trade him now? The Mariners have money, just dropped a ................load of salary, and are at the bottom of the American League, what do they actually have to lose by keeping him? And what exactly do they have to win by trading him?

just-blaze
11-27-08, 03:26 PM
Let's be honest here, they traded a ................load for him just last winter. Why, despite his injuries and pending free agency, would they trade him now? If you owned him, would you trade him now? The Mariners have money, just dropped a ................load of salary, and are at the bottom of the American League, what do they actually have to lose by keeping him? And what exactly do they have to win by trading him?

Nothing. I don't think it will happen.

But he will not get back anything close to what they traded for him, so at this point they need to be shopping him around and seeing what they could possibly pick up for an injury riddled supposed cancer.

They can roll the dice like Beane did with Harden and hope he comes out injury free and pitching on fire (which netted them not much more than one would think), or they can just accept that it was a horrible trade under the old regime and addition by subtraction might be the best available option ala Abreu/Gillick/Phillies.

yank4life2005
11-27-08, 06:52 PM
Matsui and a prospect?

Maybe sign Dunn for DH?

hockeypuck2008
11-27-08, 08:12 PM
Nothing. I don't think it will happen.

But he will not get back anything close to what they traded for him, so at this point they need to be shopping him around and seeing what they could possibly pick up for an injury riddled supposed cancer.

They can roll the dice like Beane did with Harden and hope he comes out injury free and pitching on fire (which netted them not much more than one would think), or they can just accept that it was a horrible trade under the old regime and addition by subtraction might be the best available option ala Abreu/Gillick/Phillies.

of coarse not but that is no reason to trade him, to get something, anything. He rebounds and they can sell him to the highest bidder at the trade deadline, that is probably their plan. I haven't heard anything about him being a cancer and I live in Washington state.

ThePinStripes
11-28-08, 07:08 PM
It makes no sense for the Mariners to trade him right now. They wont come close to the value they had to give up to get him in return. Unless Bedard is demanding a trade, I dont see it happening.
Agreed. If I was them, I'd be thinking:

He can't do worse than last year- his value cant drop any further. Hidden benefit of rock bottom. No risk in keeping him- his value either increases or stays the same.
In keeping him, on of the following scenarios have to play out

1. He sucks and:
His trade value is the same and they get just as much for him at some point before the trade deadline
----or---
Contributes as much as what they can expect crappy prospects they'd get
from a trade

2. He does well and
His trade value goes up and they get better prospects from him from a team mid-season that is looking to gain an edge (ref: 2008 Cubs, Brewers)
----or---
He contributes and helps the team win some games. Maybe he'll stop being a clubhouse cancer as a bonus.

No way I'd be interested in selling him at market value right now.



As the Yankees I'm thinking

Why? I can get more for less:
Bedard
-Risks/Negatives:
--Club house cancer
--Performance questionable when healthy (3.67 ERA in the AL West in one of the pitcher-friendliest parks!?)
--Injuries
--Will hate it here

--The Cost:
--Prospects
--money

Burnett/Sheets
-Risks/Negatives:
--Injuries

-The Cost:
--Money

Peavy
-Risks/Negatives:
--Might not like it here (Not nearly as bad as Bedard)
--ERA booms when he pitches away from Diego- which is the pitcher friendliest park in baseball and he's in the NL West (lowest offensive production in all of MLB)


-Cost:
--Prospects
--Money

ThePinStripes
11-28-08, 07:26 PM
Just some comparisons- not to argue one way or another but just to give an objective picture.

Last season/last 3 years/Career:

Burnett ERA+: 105/127/111
Bedard ERA+: 115/127/118
Sheets ERA+: 139//116/125
Peavy ERA+: 134/131*/121

Compare that to Wang who has a career and 3 year ERA+ of ~118.

* to be fair, 1/3 of that number is his unrepresentatively HORRIFIC season where his ERA+ was 99. Consider his ERA+ for the last 5 years: 171, 134, 99, 159, 134. His 5 year average is almost 140

Note: Only Peavy i on the upswing over the course of his career and over the last 3 years

BxBomber44
11-28-08, 08:59 PM
Kevin Brown and RJ, the sequels.....only younger.

there arent many pitchers on the market that would not be the sequels, it's all about getting lucky with pitchers today because pretty much every pitcher gets hurt now a day.

DaBliz
11-29-08, 12:41 AM
He seems a lot like Moose, as far as his attitude goes, to be honest. In fact, if we could finagle a trade (pure speculation), I'd have Moose be the first one to talk to him. Just because a guy is reclusive doesn't mean he can't be a Yankee. New York isn't nearly as difficult to play in as most people assume, you just have to have the right attitude. In fact, an attitude like his might just fit in. He'd get a bum rap from the media but I really don't think he cares about it. NYC affects players who care too much more than players who don't care. If we could buy low on Bedard, I would definitely consider him as good as a Burnett or Sheets. He might get on a lot of bad sides but he's also likely to produce. I'd rather have a productive pitcher that's an ass than someone who can't pitch worth a damn.

YanksFan1992
11-29-08, 12:46 AM
He seems a lot like Moose, as far as his attitude goes, to be honest. In fact, if we could finagle a trade (pure speculation), I'd have Moose be the first one to talk to him. Just because a guy is reclusive doesn't mean he can't be a Yankee. New York isn't nearly as difficult to play in as most people assume, you just have to have the right attitude. In fact, an attitude like his might just fit in. He'd get a bum rap from the media but I really don't think he cares about it. NYC affects players who care too much more than players who don't care. If we could buy low on Bedard, I would definitely consider him as good as a Burnett or Sheets. He might get on a lot of bad sides but he's also likely to produce. I'd rather have a productive pitcher that's an ass than someone who can't pitch worth a damn.
Bedard is soooooo far from Moose when it comes to attitude it's not even funny. This guy is far worse than Randy Johnson. He couldn't even handle the Seattle media, think about how he'd deal with New York.

DaBliz
11-29-08, 12:57 AM
Bedard is soooooo far from Moose when it comes to attitude it's not even funny. This guy is far worse than Randy Johnson. He couldn't even handle the Seattle media, think about how he'd deal with New York.



"I don't want to reveal anything about myself," says Bedard, who's revered by teammates. "If you want a quote, don't come to me. I won't give it to you. Anything baseballwise, that's fine. Other than that, don't ask me any other questions. I don't want my life to be out there."

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2978076

I think a lot of it is that he doesn't want to talk to the media. I, as I'm sure most of you, don't care how he treats the media. The only downside to players like him is that the media goes out of his way to put him down because he doesn't participate in their interviews. This might lead to him getting down on himself and could affect his performance. Like Mussina, however, I really don't think Erik cares about it. The whole "clubhouse cancer" thing is WAY overblown. I mean, let's be honest here, he's a starting pitcher. While the actual everyday lineup might gel together better if they get along and like each other, pitchers are on their own island once every five games and don't have to be the most popular guy on the team to produce.

My main point is that I think it's the MEDIA that changes the perception surrounding Bedard.


Also, it's pretty important(imo) for the Yankees to have a lefty in the rotation if CC and Pettitte don't sign.

Abe Frohman
11-29-08, 08:18 AM
My main point is that I think it's the MEDIA that changes the perception surrounding Bedard.


Also, it's pretty important(imo) for the Yankees to have a lefty in the rotation if CC and Pettitte don't sign.


Its not like we'd be acquiring The Gambler either ... Erik Bedard has sick stuff and can get it done in the AL East. I'd love to have this guy in Pinstripes.

just-blaze
11-29-08, 02:34 PM
of coarse not but that is no reason to trade him, to get something, anything. He rebounds and they can sell him to the highest bidder at the trade deadline, that is probably their plan. I haven't heard anything about him being a cancer and I live in Washington state.

And if he doesn't rebound, then they gave up Sherrill, Jones, and Co. for nothing.......

Harden rebounded very well, and the A's really didn't get much more than I thought they could have sold for in the post-season.

All Im saying is if they get an interesting offer, it wouldn't be out of the question to see them take it.

Blazer
11-29-08, 05:47 PM
doubt it, but Melky and a B prospect would be the only way i would do it

Melky is a B prospect, but the M's are desperate for a CF now that Ichiro has restaked his claim to RF. Melky + Kennedy + a reliever for their weak BP may be enough.

Abe Frohman
11-29-08, 05:58 PM
Melky is a B prospect, but the M's are desperate for a CF now that Ichiro has restaked his claim to RF. Melky + Kennedy + a reliever for their weak BP may be enough.

If this was all it would take to net Bedard, i'd drive them all to the Airport right now.
This package plus one of our better prospects would def get him though. Im stumped
as to which one i wouldnt mind giving up though ...

teknetic
11-29-08, 07:10 PM
Melky is a B prospect, but the M's are desperate for a CF now that Ichiro has restaked his claim to RF. Melky + Kennedy + a reliever for their weak BP may be enough.

I can't imagine anyone being so desperate that they would want Melky.

DaSh 1s
11-29-08, 07:38 PM
Why do people want to trade for Bedard? He is out for a portion of next year and THEN he is a FA?

Melan-cynic
11-29-08, 10:14 PM
Bedard is coming off shoulder surgery and there is no guarantee his stuff will return to "sick" levels. He may well come back with stuff more resembling The Gambler.

No one is taking Melky back in a trade unless it is a pure salary dump (Mike Cameron), which is not the case with a Bedard.

DaSh 1s
12-01-08, 09:41 AM
But the point I am trying to get at, isn't he OUT for a PORTION of next season.

Melan-cynic
12-01-08, 11:06 AM
Most likely, yes.

DaSh 1s
12-01-08, 02:19 PM
So then it would be absolutely retarded to trade for him? Why would we trade anything for about half a season of a pitcher rehabing from shoulder surgery.

Idiotic.